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Old 15-12-2015, 05:37   #496
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Re: Oyster Problems?

And I don't know how Polina Star get a LLoyds 100 standar stamped in the documents,, no cut out samples from the hull laminate? my god , really?
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Old 15-12-2015, 05:45   #497
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Re: Oyster Problems?

Worth to read this blog, with fresh pictures from Polina Star.
http://www.google.es/url?sa=t&rct=j&...ECTrxUooPtSk3w
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Old 15-12-2015, 05:54   #498
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Re: Oyster Problems?

Polina Star damage survey report.
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/jix6qieym...%2015.pdf?dl=0
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Old 15-12-2015, 05:55   #499
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Re: Oyster Problems?

More Survey report.
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/jix6qieym...eport.pdf?dl=0
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Old 15-12-2015, 05:56   #500
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Re: Oyster Problems?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dockhead View Post
Obviously a very well built boat

Maybe Oyster could hire the designer as a consultant
Sydney yachts are built in Europe under license by Salona. I like the boats and asked then why they were so expensive. They said they were very hard to build, take a lot of time and effort. It is difficult and expensive to build light strong boats and that's why production performance cruisers are more expensive than main market production boats with the same kind of finish.
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Old 15-12-2015, 05:59   #501
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Re: Oyster Problems?

They survey the boat again and a ultrasound test is conducted in the laminate, the Oyster structural designer in charge in place, nothing wrong found,,, amazing!!!
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/jix6qieym...02014.pdf?dl=0




Jesus froking crist.,,, they drill holes in the 5 mm stub partitions and the thicknes are as expected... Cant believe what I read....
Who is Harvey Jones Technical Director...
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Old 15-12-2015, 06:13   #502
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Re: Oyster Problems?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ann T. Cate View Post
It's a small difference in words, Polux, but I bet Muckle Flugga meant, "designed to survive rollovers, and be able to continue sailing thereafter," not "designed to be capsized."

Apologies if I have misinterpreted either of you gentlemen.

You'd also have to add me to your list of people who think my boat should be able to survive a rollover without dismasting and be sailable thereafter...
...Ann
All modern class A boats are designed to survive a capsize (that is one of the things RCD is about). They are not designed to be capsized.

Statistics show that very few small boats are capsized and stay with an undamaged mast. That was all to do with luck and with a capsize to be a gentle one. If the boat is rolled violently the mast is gone.

Surviving a capsize is the ultimate safety feature on a monohull. No monohull is designed to be capsized and capsized again and going on sailing happily.

When a boat is capsized, specially if it is rolled violently, as many times is the case, the crew suffers injuries due to be thrown around violently and being hit by flying objects.

Most crews abandon boats after some severe knock downs while facing the risk of being rolled and almost all abandon the boat after a roll that almost always bring some damage to the boat. The number that will remain on the boat after several rolls is insignificant. If the conditions persist a crew will not wait for being rolled again and again. That has nothing to do with the boat but with good seamanship and good sense.

Even small boats designed specifically as voyage boats, known to be very strong and seaworthy, can not only be capsized but sunk due to a capsize.

That was the case with an Alliage 44, a very seaworthy and very strong aluminum voyage boat in good condition, sailed by 3 very experienced sailors. They were caught by a storm that went more south than previewed and rolled violently by a 10m breaker.

They were making a transat not on winter (15/5) and not on the North Atlantic high latitudes.

Stating that a small sailboat boat is designed to "unrestricted ocean service" and "precisely designed to be capsized, rolled again and again, and come up smiling.. Some even so designed to keep their rigs" is not only absurd but dangerous to the ones that eventually would believe in that, if a forum like this gives wide support to this kind ideas, regarding the seaworthiness of a small sailboat for unrestricted ocean service.

I will not post more about this on this thread or anything more than what is related with object of the thread: Oysters with problems.
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Old 15-12-2015, 07:04   #503
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Re: Oyster Problems?

Anyone with any sense will never buy a new oyster, or any yacht David Tydeman is involved with.

Quote:
Dear Alexander,

I have read your email below carefully and it appears that we failed to explain the design aspects of the keel on the 825 thoroughly enough before you left for the ARC last year – if that is the case then I apologise for this. Some movement in the keel is expected and this will cause the join to work; what you have experienced is not excessive or unusual for this design even if it does appear greater than might be found on other yachts and I can understand that a surveyor who does not have a full understanding of why this is acceptable may reach a different conclusion. In order to explain this fully I would like to have the opportunity to discuss this with you in person, or at the very least, by phone.

As you will understand, since there is no defect I cannot accept either of your proposals below and seek to reassure you why you should continue to have confidence in, and enjoy, your yacht.

Sincerely

David Tydeman
Chief Executive
Oyster Group"
If you want to attach a name and face to the industry's move to place profits over safety, I'd say this criminally negligent piece of garbage is a good place to start.

Here's some more great work of his, on the oyster sites media section (http://www.oysteryachts.com/breaking...rategic-steps/)

Quote:
Following the successful launch of the new Oyster 825, Oyster 885 and Oyster 100, we have responded to an increased demand for customisation with each of the five new 80 footers in build at present being quite different. At the same time we strive to increase our competitiveness by bringing down our productions costs and to increase the interaction with our clients where our boats are constructed or where they are sailing.
"I really love Oysters brand equity. I'm going to personally liquidate it by selling junk at premium prices until the market catches on."

Ok, maybe I'm grasping at straws a bit with that example, but still, there's never a 'smoking gun'. Just a bunch of possibly semi-reasonable decisions that just consistently weighed profit over all else....until the keel fell off.
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Old 15-12-2015, 07:08   #504
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Re: Oyster Problems?

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Originally Posted by chris95040 View Post
Anyone with any sense will never buy a new oyster, or any yacht David Tydeman is involved with.



If you want to attach a name and face to the industry's move to place profits over safety, I'd say this criminally negligent piece of garbage is a good place to start.

Vampires!!!!!
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Old 15-12-2015, 07:13   #505
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Re: Oyster Problems?

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Originally Posted by neilpride View Post
Thanks for posting it.

But unfortunately it is not interesting. It is one paid by the owner with the main objective of showing that the boat had not impacted any object before lost the keel and to make clear that the boat is not a recoverable one but a write-off.

The most interesting part has to do with something that the skipper had already stated here regarding an opening between the keel and the keel stub and the amazing Oyster's reply to that: basically that it was normal.

This document that you posted:
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/jix6qieym...02014.pdf?dl=0
is a lot more interesting. It shows what I had said previously regarding the access or any repair to the keel area on this boat to be very difficult and very expensive. Even the engine has to be taken off as well as other equipment.

Regarding the content of the letter it is quite astonishing and it can be resumed light that:

Yes the boat has a problem, we checked everything but could not find the fault, so we put everything together and tightened the keel bolts again.

They say that no keel bolt was found with a torque of less than 75% of the original one and that means that the problem of the keel beaming lose had nothing to do with the bolts becoming lose, but even so the only thing they had done was to tight them better.

The skipper said that the boat was put again out of water, on the other side of the Atlantic, after this repair and after having crossed the Atlantic, just to see if everything was Ok and it was not, the problem persisted and even with bolts tightened over the previous specifications, again there was a gab between the stub and the keel.

Oyster was contacted and they did not bother to send nobody there to see what was happening, saying that everything was alright (quite incredible).

That gab in my opinion had to do with the vertical supports of the keel structure that linked the stub to the superior part of the keel structure to be already on a state of degradation. It was pretty clear that if the problem was not with the bolts, it had to be with that part of the keel structure but Oyster prefer to believe that was not possible.

All the story is quite unbelievable and shows an irresponsible behavior from Oyster. The main conclusion is that this accident could be clearly avoided since all symptoms that something was very wrong with the keel were there to everybody see.
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Old 15-12-2015, 07:20   #506
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Re: Oyster Problems?

Hulls 825/01 and Hull 825/3 are build the same way,,, conclusion, some Skipper out there is sailing a 80 ft 60 tons yacht with a 15 mm laminate thicknes stub... Time for a serious 825 recall as soon as posible.... LLoyds need to rethink if keep the 825 classification or not, even after the repairs since I think this is BS in all the aspects , if a stub is 15 mm thick hard to believe that with few layers of glass the problem its fixed.. unless they rebuild the whole mess...
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Old 15-12-2015, 07:46   #507
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Re: Oyster Problems?

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Originally Posted by neilpride View Post
Vampires!!!!!
I'm with you in spirit, but i think that assigns too much emotion to it. The unfortunate reality is just ambivalence toward anything other than gaining wealth.

I do invite a rebuttal from mr. tydeman, after calling him out in public forum its only fair, although plebes like us don't even exist in his reality.
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Old 15-12-2015, 08:11   #508
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Re: Oyster Problems?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Polux View Post

All the story is quite unbelievable and shows an irresponsible behavior from Oyster. The main conclusion is that this accident could be clearly avoided since all symptoms that something was very wrong with the keel were there to everybody see.
+1. But its amazing what you can ignore when you just don't give a ****.
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Old 15-12-2015, 08:38   #509
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Re: Oyster Problems?

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Originally Posted by neilpride View Post
Excellent, yes .... No matter what ,,,since is a live or dead situation,
Kind of Jet Liners never ever can loose a wing,, and if it happen that particular plane is subject to a extensive investigation, if they found a faulty design, material or improper maintenance , they fine the company...
Ground the whole fleet, and rectify the issue in the future , something boat builders are free from this kind of regulations at the moment,,,
What would you say about a plane that had hit its wing into something solid every now and then and keeps flying without a thorough inspection and possible repair needed?

There are quite a few planes that have lost their wings in an accident.

So its never ever only in normal flying conditions with very thorough inspection/repair after every accident or abnormal condition.
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Old 15-12-2015, 08:50   #510
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Re: Oyster Problems?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cap Erict3 View Post
Below is a pic of a ships water tight door. Never saw one on a fiberglass sailboat. They are designed to contain flooding.

Attachment 115076

I have spent a bit of time in those orange lifeboats. Even a test drive isn't fun. My comment was about plastic sailboats, not life capsules.

My main complaint is this insistence on touting the virtues of pleasure boats capable of surviving Fastnet like conditions. They ain't built for it.


I have ridden out some bad weather on ships and boats that were built to handle it, but when hurricanes threatened we made preparations to run.

Yes, there are plenty of tough sail boats. Sometimes tough ain't enough.





Those newbies that take that rubbish to heart have my condolences.

Bad weather damages boats.

The US navy runs from bad weather.

No such thing as a boat designed for unrestricted weather service.





Never use a hundred words when 3 will carry the message.


Here in the states, when installed on small boats, they are generally known by the manufacturers name. That's a Freeman hatch to me, and I have installed many on small sail boats. Perhaps it helps to live somewhere where that sort of weather is fairly common?



Cast and Fabricated Marine Hatches: Freeman Marine
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