Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 14-11-2008, 08:34   #1
Registered User
 
Amgine's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Vancouver BC
Posts: 1,384
Images: 1
Newport Beach city considers ordinance governing anchoring

PR work relying on scare tactics is being reported from Newport Beach officials.
Quote:
A few recent water quality readings from the waters off Corona del Mar showed high levels of bacteria...

As many as 15 boats are parked off the beach in Corona del Mar on any given day, Miller said...
The other argument put forth is that a couple of boats have washed ashore recently, one of which was unmanned.

DailyPilot.com
__________________

__________________
Amgine
Blog

On the internet, nobody knows you're a dog anchored in a coral atoll.
Amgine is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14-11-2008, 08:50   #2
Registered User
 
CaptHead's Avatar

Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: Los Angeles, CA
Boat: Grand Banks 42 Classic - Heads Up
Posts: 109
Images: 1
Send a message via Yahoo to CaptHead
The California Grey Whale poops the same amount as 1800 people poops and the whale does it three times a day. That is the same as 5400 people. There is no ill effect from the whales and nature has a way of using the waste of animals to feed other life. That is nature. It works on land and in the sea.

There is nothing like a knee jerk reaction from an elected politition to make your day. I bet the run off from the storm drains from dog poop isn't a consideration. I know that in the Marina Del Rey area they did a knee jerk on the boaters there. When all was said and done, they found it was the geese and ducks living in the Venice canals that was the cause. Did they reverse the ruling??? Hell no.

They are trying to control every aspect of our daily lives. I think it will only get worse.
__________________

__________________
Captain Head
1966 Grand Banks 42 Hull #17
Twin Ford Lehman Diesels
Sterling LP over Epoxy
Life is Great, Skip the Beach
CaptHead is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14-11-2008, 09:07   #3
Eternal Member
 
imagine2frolic's Avatar

Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Las Brisas Panama AGAIN!
Boat: Simpson, Catamaran, 46ft. IMAGINE
Posts: 4,508
Images: 123
Just go to any industrial site close to the water. If they want to fine someone. Then places like that is where they should be looking. Lat38 has done many articles on the refineries vs the turd. I am not saying it's okay to pump over. I am saying they need to get their prioities in order.
__________________
SAILING is not always a slick magazine cover!
BORROWED..No single one of is as smart as all of us!
http://sailingwithcancer.blogspot.com/
imagine2frolic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14-11-2008, 09:26   #4
CF Adviser
 
Pelagic's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Oct 2007
Boat: Van Helleman Schooner 65ft StarGazer
Posts: 6,895
Sour Grapes!

I am fully convinced that these municipalities just hate live-aboards because they live off the grid, cannot be easily pigenholed and controlled, and what bothers them the most……seem happy with their lifestyle.


The taxman just doesn't like to get his feet wet!
__________________
Pelagic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14-11-2008, 12:16   #5
Marine Service Provider
 
AnchorageGuy's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Wherever the boat is!
Boat: Marine Trader 34DC
Posts: 4,618
Those are the excuses the cities use but here a some of the real reasons.Click image for larger version

Name:	b.jpg
Views:	168
Size:	68.9 KB
ID:	5847Click image for larger version

Name:	a.jpg
Views:	199
Size:	90.5 KB
ID:	5848
__________________
Chesapeake Bay, ICW Hampton Roads To Key West, The Gulf Coast, The Bahamas

The Trawler Beach House
Voyages Of Sea Trek
AnchorageGuy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14-11-2008, 13:23   #6
Eternal Member
 
imagine2frolic's Avatar

Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Las Brisas Panama AGAIN!
Boat: Simpson, Catamaran, 46ft. IMAGINE
Posts: 4,508
Images: 123
Chuck,

These boats are less than liveaboards. They are pollution, and will eventually be a cost to us taxpayers. Richardson Bay near San Francisco was at one time littered with derilicts. They were no more than floating shanty shacks. It's a shame that so many people when they think of liveaboards think of this kind of situation.

Yes, we are off the grid, and it is hard for them to get a grip on us. That must irritate them....lololololol
__________________
SAILING is not always a slick magazine cover!
BORROWED..No single one of is as smart as all of us!
http://sailingwithcancer.blogspot.com/
imagine2frolic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14-11-2008, 14:53   #7
Registered User
 
svHyLyte's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Tampa Bay area, USA
Boat: Beneteau First 42
Posts: 3,434
Images: 25
Considering that San Diego Creek runs all the way to Newport Harbor from Tustin and transports a breath taking (if not completely choaking) amout of garbage, filth, sewerage and debris to Newport, particularly after any rain storm, how bacteria in the water off Carona del Mar could be attributed to a few yacht escapes me. I suspect this is more an issue of preventing "unsightly" boats from imposing on a few very costly "view corridors".

s/v HyLyte

PS: At one point in my life I was proud to say "I am from California"--I am now proud to say I am far from California.
__________________
"It is not so much for its beauty that the Sea makes a claim upon men's hearts, as for that subtle something, that quality of air, that emanation from the waves, that so wonderfully renews a weary spirit."
svHyLyte is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14-11-2008, 21:58   #8
Senior Cruiser
 
delmarrey's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Now in Blaine, WA
Boat: Modified Choate 40
Posts: 10,702
Images: 122
Maybe us boaters should start complaining that the landlubbers are polluting OUR waters (home). And then monitor the run off that comes from the run-off after a rain fall (as if it ever rains )

And then report the results to the media! Just like the PCers do. It's time to return fire!
__________________
Faithful are the Wounds of a Friend, but the Kisses of the Enemy are Deceitful! ........
A nation of sheep breeds a government of wolves!

Unprepared boaters, end up as floatsum!.......
delmarrey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 14-11-2008, 23:37   #9
CF Adviser
Moderator Emeritus
 
TaoJones's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Dec 2006
Location: Montrose, Colorado
Posts: 9,850
Quote:
Originally Posted by svHyLyte View Post
Considering that San Diego Creek runs all the way to Newport Harbor from Tustin and transports a breath taking (if not completely choaking) amout of garbage, filth, sewerage and debris to Newport, particularly after any rain storm, how bacteria in the water off Carona del Mar could be attributed to a few yacht escapes me. I suspect this is more an issue of preventing "unsightly" boats from imposing on a few very costly "view corridors".

s/v HyLyte

PS: At one point in my life I was proud to say "I am from California"--I am now proud to say I am far from California.
As someone who still proudly calls California, and Newport Beach, in particular, home, I feel I must respond to your derogatory and uninformed post, HyLyte.

It's possible that it's been quite some time since you left California, so you may not know that Upper Newport Bay (or the "Back Bay" as most here refer to it) is presently one of the most pristine wetland habitats on the entire west coast. Of course, it wasn't always so, and that may be what you're remembering.

A group of political, civic, and corporate stakeholders joined forces several years ago, dedicated to the goal of restoring the Back Bay to its former healthy, natural state. The result of their combined efforts is what you will find there today - an idyllic, natural resource enjoyed by people from the surrounding area who appreciate the opportunity to commune with nature in the midst of the seemingly endless urban sprawl that is Southern California.

Lest anyone get the wrong idea from your description of San Diego Creek running ". . . all the way to Newport Harbor from Tustin," the distance is, in reality, less than ten miles. And the area through which the creek flows is certainly not filled with heavy industry or other sources of pollution. It is primarily upper-middle-class residential, or, I suppose, just middle-class by Orange County standards.

It is true that urban run-off has a major impact on the ocean from the Los Angeles / Ventura County line all the way through Tijuana. Those who monitor such things refer to it as the "first flush" when the first couple of winter rains carry the sorts of man-made pollution you describe to the ocean. But the problem isn't San Diego Creek, it's the system of storm drains that carry the water (and what is in it) to the ocean.

If the ". . . breath taking [sic] (if not completely choaking [sic]) amout [sic] of garbage, filth, sewerage [sic] and debris . . ." you describe were to flow down San Diego Creek into the Back Bay, it would quickly become a candidate for a Superfund clean up site. It was never even remotely as bad as that.

It had become silted in, however, and largely neglected. Today, it is a beautiful, 752-acre natural habitat best enjoyed, in my view, by kayak (power boats are forbidden in the Back Bay). Two + years of dredging were necessary just to begin the process of restoration of the Back Bay. If not for the impact from the noise of departing jets from John Wayne Airport when they take off over the bay, Upper Newport Bay could probably be described as "perfect."

The abundant flora and fauna must find it nearly so, as they seem not to mind the jet traffic at all.

Of course, to keep the Back Bay the ecological gem it now is, additional dredging is necessary to keep it from silting in once again. That is the present state of things, as torrential rains over the last ten years have deposited so much detritus into the Back Bay that some bird species are threatened by coyotes wading across shallow mud flats to once-safe islands used by the birds for nesting.

Please forgive my earnest defense of an area that is not at all as your post might lead some to conclude. My former father-in-law was instrumental in the restoration of the Back Bay - an effort he was (and still is) quite passionate about - and I cannot let his good work, and the beautiful area it produced, go undefended.

TaoJones
__________________
"Your vision becomes clear only when you look into your own heart. Who looks outside, dreams; who looks within, awakens."
Carl Gustav Jung (1875-1961)
TaoJones is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-11-2008, 06:48   #10
Registered User
 
svHyLyte's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2006
Location: Tampa Bay area, USA
Boat: Beneteau First 42
Posts: 3,434
Images: 25
Tao,

You offer an articulate and erudite defense of Newport.

For my part, I am well acquainted with the “Back Bay” having frequently commuted to my office (at the corner of Birch and MacArthur) along Back Bay Drive (before the unfortunate extension of 73) to avoid the jamb-ups and insanity on Jamboree. While we have not been resident for some time, I did commute between southwest Florida and SoCal bi-weekly until 9/11, but less so since (And, you are absolutely correct. The Back Bay has improved a thousand fold since 1992.) My observations, however, were less based on the foregoing than on having been a guest at some close friends’ home, located on Northstar Lane near the terminus of San Diego Creek/Back Bay, just across the road from the beach where many launch their kayaks, during last winter’s rains. During a break in the weather on a Saturday morning we, and the residents of several other of the homes along the canal, spent several hours with pool sweeps and boat hooks pulling all manner of detritus out of the water, which itself was covered with a patina sheen from street run-off, —two 55 gallon bags worth in our case.

As for the “only 10 mile stretch of San Diego Creek”, the San Diego Creek drainage basin includes approximately 77,000 acres—of which 81% is “urbanized”, including (as of 2002) 11,688 acres of residential use, 10,000+ acres of industrial/commercial use; and, over 10,000 acres of roadways—and contributes roughly 95% of the surface water runoff into Newport Bay. Rather than continuing to site statistics, points and authorities, I simply submit that the impact of 15 boats … parked off the beach in Corona del Mar every day' is undetectable, even if the boat-owners don’t use holding tanks, in comparison with the impacts of the foregoing—no matter how well “remediated”.

FWIW...

s/v HyLyte
__________________
"It is not so much for its beauty that the Sea makes a claim upon men's hearts, as for that subtle something, that quality of air, that emanation from the waves, that so wonderfully renews a weary spirit."
svHyLyte is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-11-2008, 08:07   #11
Registered User

Join Date: Jun 2006
Boat: CT54
Posts: 358
Images: 3
The fact that Newport Beach wants to put anchoring restrictions on the open ocean (outside breakwater)scares the hell out of me. Can we as a people of this country really afford to give another of our hard earned rights away?
On the other hand I understand that the boats anchored out there seem to be nothing but a headache for the harbor patrol and the city of Newport.
I am not sure what the answer is but there has to be a better option than all of us loosing our rights.
Jackie
__________________
jackiepitts is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-11-2008, 08:19   #12
Marine Service Provider
 
AnchorageGuy's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Wherever the boat is!
Boat: Marine Trader 34DC
Posts: 4,618
Quote:
Originally Posted by jackiepitts View Post
The fact that Newport Beach wants to put anchoring restrictions on the open ocean (outside breakwater)scares the hell out of me. Can we as a people of this country really afford to give another of our hard earned rights away?
On the other hand I understand that the boats anchored out there seem to be nothing but a headache for the harbor patrol and the city of Newport.
I am not sure what the answer is but there has to be a better option than all of us loosing our rights.
Jackie
There is a very simple answer to the issue but for whatever reason the municipalities and counties and states REFUSE to take action other than imposing more regulations. There are existing laws, both state and federal regarding boat safety, and sanitation requirements. All that needs to be done is inspection of these vessels by local authorities to assure they comply with these regulations. If they do not than fines are in order. This happens to many of us while cruising US waters as a normal course of events by the US Coast Guard and occasionally local authorities. If these boats comply they are no problem. If they don't you can be assured they will move on. This is how Key Biscayne cleaned up all of the derelicts without passing any local ordinances. Those of us that cruise and comply would then have no issues. So why is this approach ignored? Perhaps we might go to these local authorities and suggest this method as a first approach instead of further regulations that might be challenged in court.
__________________
Chesapeake Bay, ICW Hampton Roads To Key West, The Gulf Coast, The Bahamas

The Trawler Beach House
Voyages Of Sea Trek
AnchorageGuy is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-11-2008, 08:59   #13
Moderator Emeritus
 
David M's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: San Francisco Bay
Boat: research vessel
Posts: 10,152
Fecal coliform bacteria counts are a convenient excuse. This local government agency appears to be listening solely to those who pay taxes and everyone else be damned. If the taxpayers want the ugly boats gone, then that's how it shall be. Money talks, wanderers walk.

I just got done doing a study for a local UC university that measures fecal coliform counts in various regions of the SF Bay. One of the purposes of the study was to determine which species are ultimately putting their "doo doo" in the water. My point is that through DNA analysis, it can be determined just what species are causing high coliform counts....which would completely invalidate Newport's claim if the same study was done there.

BTW, the refineries are not putting anything into the Bay waters. They do use Bay water to cool various things at the refineries, so there is some "heat pollution". The refineries here are under enormous pressure from a number of agencies to put nothing in the Bay and their water discharge is under constant monitoring by a variety of different instruments which sense different pollutants. I have seen the pollution monitors on a couple plants myself. I also did a thermal plume study to see if a rapid temperature change might affect migratory species like King and Silver salmon....it doesn't. The thermal plumes dissipate very fast.

What really pollutes the Bay are non-point sources such as storm drains. Storm drains pollute by far more than anything else. Anything that ends up on the street ultimatly ends up in the Bay such as tire scrub, brake dust, engine oil, transmission fluid, detergents, garden pesticide, fertilizers...you name it. The other major source of occasional pollution are sewage treatment plants that are overwhelmed with rain water during major storm events. Sometimes these plants can only do primary treatment for solids..which means massive amounts of bacteria are released into the Bay. I have also done studies mandated by local governments and sometimes the EPA that are paid for by the dischargers that measure their effluent.
__________________
David

Life begins where land ends.
David M is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-11-2008, 15:25   #14
Eternal Member
 
imagine2frolic's Avatar

Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: Las Brisas Panama AGAIN!
Boat: Simpson, Catamaran, 46ft. IMAGINE
Posts: 4,508
Images: 123
That's great to know the refineries have cleaned up their acts. I have been gone since 02, and had quit reading lat38 a couple of years ahead of that. Progress can be a wonderful thing.

Still the fact that raw sewage gets dumped for what ever reason, and yes the flow from the streets. These seem to be a much higher priority to control. What I don't understand is that it is perfectly legal to use a bucket, and toss it. Yet it is a crime to flush it. What's the difference?
__________________
SAILING is not always a slick magazine cover!
BORROWED..No single one of is as smart as all of us!
http://sailingwithcancer.blogspot.com/
imagine2frolic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 15-11-2008, 15:47   #15
Registered User
 
orion1's Avatar

Join Date: May 2006
Location: Slidell, Louisiana, USA
Boat: William Atkin Cutter, 35'
Posts: 147
Images: 8
Check out cruisersnet.net, Florida has been trying to do this for years. Cruisersnet reports on all such attempts. Laws have been passed by cities but have been overturned in the courts. Some have gone to jail to prove the laws unjust and a violation of Federal Laws re: navigation. They have been found innocent.

This is a great site as much has already researched for others. FL is our main cruising ground so we keep on top of this issue.
__________________

__________________
"Love My Country, Fear My Government"
orion1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
anchor, anchoring, newport beach, regulations

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Ocean City , NJ ? Beausoleil Atlantic & the Caribbean 6 12-08-2012 18:45
New York City! Intentional Drifter Atlantic & the Caribbean 20 17-09-2009 18:26
Reputable Surveyor in Newport Beach area? Cassive Dollars & Cents 1 27-01-2009 12:37
First channel crossing - Newport Beach to Catalina Island AVSkipper General Sailing Forum 7 02-09-2008 19:48
'Lost City' GordMay Atlantic & the Caribbean 0 09-03-2005 17:21



Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 12:57.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.