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Old 13-02-2013, 09:13   #556
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Re: Merged Threads: HMS Bounty

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Originally Posted by Captain Jeffry View Post
Completely concur. Authorities have found many boats abandoned and flaoting nicely after storms, months after her crew has taken to life rafts.
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Only (continuing) troubling issues for me are reasons, timing, and final decision for departure and of course, Captain's apparent long term desires for hurricane encounters. just sayin'...
the perfect storm: the 32' westsail made it all the way past the Chesapeake and beached itself in sail away condition. the crew could have been killed the way they abandoned ship. i forget the name of the wahine that prepared to sail around the world by sailing into every storm she could find, including the back end of a hurricane. or good old ted turner who completed the fastnet during a virtual hurricane as others sunk or gave up. he did not even notice it being 110 knot winds and 50 foot seas. said he had a grand time sailing under such conditions and did not feel the boat was in danger.
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Old 13-02-2013, 09:16   #557
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Re: Merged Threads: HMS Bounty

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and no, you dont get sucked down with the ship unless your inside.
Two crew members report getting tangled in the ship's rigging as she rolled and pulled underwater up to 15 feet. Both report that they feel it is basically a miracle that they got free and made it to the surface. So, you may not get "sucked" under, but waiting until too late and having your platform dump you in the water in an unplanned manner can be dangerous too.

One absolute of the sea - we weren't there and don't know the exact conditions or situations that caused actions to be taken when they were taken.
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Old 13-02-2013, 09:47   #558
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Re: Merged Threads: HMS Bounty

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Two crew members report getting tangled in the ship's rigging as she rolled and pulled underwater up to 15 feet. Both report that they feel it is basically a miracle that they got free and made it to the surface. So, you may not get "sucked" under, but waiting until too late and having your platform dump you in the water in an unplanned manner can be dangerous too.

One absolute of the sea - we weren't there and don't know the exact conditions or situations that caused actions to be taken when they were taken.
your correct that rigging can entangle one, but so can being bashed against the side of a floating hull when one is in the water. in bad conditions, one can simply not swim away from a hull. the wave action overpowers. why professional sinkers leave by the end that is most in the water. the navy and merchant maritime produced a cute book back in war times entitled "how to abandon ship." if your planning to sink, good reading.
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Old 13-02-2013, 10:48   #559
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Video from news station http://www.wavy.com/generic/news/hms-bounty-hearings
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Old 13-02-2013, 18:58   #560
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Re: Merged Threads: HMS Bounty

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yup, at the helm, standing up, in full uniform(assuming such), and staring straight ahead. no holding breath and no giggling either. well maybe a "wtf" or a feeling of "SOL" as the cold sea creeps up your pant legs.
I see you have been watching too many old movies again. Is that where you come up with this stuff? The captain is always responsible for the safety of the crew and vessel, then his own safety.

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absolute rule of the sea, never abandon a floating vessel. as long as it floats, its safer than entering the seas. and no, you dont get sucked down with the ship unless your inside.
...again...where do you find this stuff. I find it amazing let alone pure rubbish.
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Old 13-02-2013, 21:56   #561
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Re: Merged Threads: HMS Bounty

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absolute rule of the sea, never abandon a floating vessel. as long as it floats, its safer than entering the seas. and no, you dont get sucked down with the ship unless your inside.
You should read this to get a real world perspective...
Hurricane Survival – No Place for Absolutes | gCaptain - Maritime & Offshore News
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Old 14-02-2013, 02:34   #562
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A more objective summary of today's hearing.

http://gcaptain.com/bounty-hearings-...tes-testifies/
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Old 14-02-2013, 06:47   #563
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Re: Merged Threads: HMS Bounty

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Originally Posted by Celestialsailor View Post
You should read this to get a real world perspective...
Hurricane Survival No Place for Absolutes | gCaptain - Maritime & Offshore News
Very interesting. Thats if one is under the umbrella of the USCG, and they know where you are, etc.
Its different if rescue is not on the way and you have to be in a liferaft through the hurricane. I would prefer to be on the foundering big boat than a rubber 4 man through a hurricane.

But his point is good about cliches making some hard and fast rule.
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Old 14-02-2013, 07:39   #564
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Re: Merged Threads: HMS Bounty

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I see you have been watching too many old movies again. Is that where you come up with this stuff? The captain is always responsible for the safety of the crew and vessel, then his own safety.


...again...where do you find this stuff. I find it amazing let alone pure rubbish.


why the "bluejacket manual" of course. early edition. so the captain of the titanic, after finding himself sol, went to the bridge and sank into history. fact as far as surviving witnesses testified.

or death before dishonor. you are your ship. old code. of course nowadays with all the whimps sailing around, things are a bit reversed: "dishonor? who cares about honor in the first place". and so the italian captain left the ship before passengers, crew, and god knows what else left behind.
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Old 14-02-2013, 07:42   #565
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Re: Merged Threads: HMS Bounty

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Very interesting. Thats if one is under the umbrella of the USCG, and they know where you are, etc.
Its different if rescue is not on the way and you have to be in a liferaft through the hurricane. I would prefer to be on the foundering big boat than a rubber 4 man through a hurricane.

But his point is good about cliches making some hard and fast rule.
agree, but...when your sinking panic steps in and good old hard and fast rules, carried out as routine, can save even the most panic stricken. not a time to have a "lets think about what we do now" session. bt/dt.
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Old 14-02-2013, 13:23   #566
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Re: Merged Threads: HMS Bounty

What was the quote supposedly attributed to Winston Churchill -- that he liked Italian ships because they had superb cuisine and none of this nonsense about women and children first? !
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Old 23-07-2013, 16:14   #567
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Re: Merged Threads: HMS Bounty

another fascinating article by Mario Vittone:

Into the Storm – The Final Days and Decisions on Bounty | gCaptain
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Old 31-07-2013, 22:48   #568
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Re: Merged Threads: HMS Bounty

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Originally Posted by reed1v
absolute rule of the sea, never abandon a floating vessel. as long as it floats, its safer than entering the seas. and no, you dont get sucked down with the ship unless your inside.

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Originally Posted by Celestialsailor View Post
...again...where do you find this stuff. I find it amazing let alone pure rubbish.
I believe that the part about not leaving the ship was one of the conclusions that was reached after the Grimalkin disaster in 79. I'm not saying that I agree with the notion across the board, but that concept is now widely supported in many circles.
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Old 31-07-2013, 22:54   #569
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Re: Merged Threads: HMS Bounty

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What was the quote supposedly attributed to Winston Churchill -- that he liked Italian ships because they had superb cuisine and none of this nonsense about women and children first? !
During Desert Storm, the Italians sent a flat top called the Giuseppe Garibaldi to aid in the effort. I am told that the ship never fired a shot, but all the generals & top brass from the entire contingent ate aboard her every night. It would seem that Churchill was not the only man to have taken notice of the food.
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Old 01-08-2013, 01:32   #570
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During Desert Storm, the Italians sent a flat top called the Giuseppe Garibaldi to aid in the effort. I am told that the ship never fired a shot, but all the generals & top brass from the entire contingent ate aboard her every night. It would seem that Churchill was not the only man to have taken notice of the food.
"The unit has participated in several international missions including: Operation Desert Shield and Desert Storm in Iraq in 1990-1; Somalia I-II in 1992-4 and Somalia III / United Shield in 1995, Kosovo in 1999; Enduring Freedom in Afghanistan in 2001-02; Lebanon in 2006. For the Enduring Freedom, Garibaldi with his group, composed of ship Zeffiro, Aviere and Etna, leaving from Taranto on November 18, 2001, he worked for 3 months in the Indian Ocean, and returned March 18, 2002. The AV-8B have carried out 288 missions for 860 hours. In total, were deployed in the theatre of operations nearly 1.500 men with tasks "Sea Control" and "Maritime Interdiction / Interception"; were also carried out missions "Close Air Support" and "Air Interdiction" on the territory of Afghanistan."

Excuse the English as this is a translation. 288 missions is a little more then not firing a shot LOL

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