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Old 04-12-2012, 10:16   #496
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Re: Merged Threads: HMS Bounty

Bligh was actually a very good seaman and his feat of navigation is well documented.

That said, although the skipper of this "bounty" made a questionable choice, the crew was not conscripted - they also knew the risks, presumably, and volunteered to go. The whole story is sad.
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Old 04-12-2012, 11:24   #497
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Re: Merged Threads: HMS Bounty

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the crew was not conscripted - they also knew the risks, presumably, and volunteered to go. The whole story is sad.
What was the alternative for the crew? Remember they had no time to think about it.

Get off immediately.
No job
No accommodation
No car


That's not much of a choice!
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Old 04-12-2012, 12:31   #498
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Thanks for posting that article. Good to hear some crew accounts finally.

"We leave in one hour, to sail into the storm". Not much of a choice for the crew.

If the ship could be built again for fifty million, the HMS Bounty III will make a wonderful motion picture using that German storyline for a script. Several of the crew, could star as themselves. No joke, someone in Hollywood no doubt is already planning it.

Sounds like Christian was knocked unconscious and drowned breathing seawater.

How do we explain the absence of a captain, no body found? His survival gear floats, and so much time has passed, he would have been found by now? Did he get tangled in the ship and pulled under? Did he walk into the ship to go down with her, as his duty?

No crew member will ever to a certainty be able to give accurate accounts of the decisions made by the captain those last hours. Last days. It will always be a lingering mystery what happened.

First mistake setting sail, last mistake not abandoning ship in daylight from a floating ship to make sure the crew could get off as safely as possible.
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Old 04-12-2012, 12:50   #499
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Re: Merged Threads: HMS Bounty

the Bounty tragedy adds another saga to the oceans' mysteries. all along the maine coast, the various villages have monuments with "roll calls" listing townsfolk lost at sea since hundreds of years ago up to present times. not uncommon to see big chunks of a family lost in a single sinking. fathers, sons, grandsons; some boys as young as 7 years old; all lost with the sinking of a family's schooner. an endless progression of the sea's slaughter. dangerous place out there.
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Old 04-12-2012, 13:57   #500
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Re: Merged Threads: HMS Bounty

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the Bounty tragedy adds another saga to the oceans' mysteries. ...an endless progression of the sea's slaughter. dangerous place out there.
Let's unravel the mystery. The ocean is perhaps more dangerous than land but only because we are formed to live on land. With a set of gills and fins the ocean is not so dangerous. The premise is of preparation and perhaps adaptability.

In these days when landlubbing tourists can arrive in a few days to a place it took Shackleton months to reach, when the prairie no longer carries the threat of hostile arrows, when having a meal carries not much more than the decision of what to eat, we are inured to the inherent dangers of our environment.

While the environment may carry risk, the greater threat is lack of preparation. I'm not even talking of abnormalcy of Bounty's captain nor whatever his motivation was. Every of us accept risk every waking moment. Usually we are well prepared to meet that risk.

These days there is a breed of men and women who are at home in the air just as others have been at home on the sea, even beneath the sea, and on the land. The only explanation is they are prepared for their environment. Make no mistake, even the land now conquered was an ugly place for those not ready to subdue the risk. It is the world which is hostile yet we have been given the means by which we not just survive but thrive.
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Old 04-12-2012, 14:14   #501
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Re: Merged Threads: HMS Bounty

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What was the alternative for the crew? Remember they had no time to think about it.

Get off immediately.
No job
No accommodation
No car


That's not much of a choice!
One other thing may have been an influence, namely to jump ship. Jumping ship is frowned upon and is to be avoided. Yet if the circumstance is dire enough, to preserve life to jump ship should be considered.

After years of telling myself I would never jump ship, I did. I was sullen for days about my choice. But after I had heard the ship had sunk with loss of life I knew I had made the right decision. I would rather stand head hanging down at the dockhead witha long walk down a lonely pier with a rancid duffle than be clinging to flotsam in cold water. I took a financial hit but I am alive!

This all came about in the aftermath of a string of poor decisions made by the captain. Crew retains their right of choice even though they've thrown their lot with the capt.
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Old 04-12-2012, 14:23   #502
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Re: Merged Threads: HMS Bounty

Don't forget, tomorrow 05DEC 5PM EST (2200UTC), The Weather Channel will show a documentary on the rescue of the Bounty.
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Old 04-12-2012, 14:49   #503
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Re: Merged Threads: HMS Bounty

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How do we explain the absence of a captain, no body found?
Um, the Atlantic Ocean is pretty big? How's that for an explanation?
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Old 04-12-2012, 14:54   #504
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Re: Merged Threads: HMS Bounty

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Let's unravel the mystery. The ocean is perhaps more dangerous than land but only because we are formed to live on land. With a set of gills and fins the ocean is not so dangerous.
While I appreciate your point, I have to disagree with that as well. In the Ocean unless you are an apex predator EVERYTHING is trying to eat you.Ever looked closely at any marine mammal? I don't think I've ever seen a seal, dolphin or Whale without some pretty significant scars
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Old 04-12-2012, 15:05   #505
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Re: Merged Threads: HMS Bounty

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While I appreciate your point, I have to disagree with that as well. In the Ocean unless you are an apex predator EVERYTHING is trying to eat you.Ever looked closely at any marine mammal? I don't think I've ever seen a seal, dolphin or Whale without some pretty significant scars
Good point. Never mind the point about gills somebody made earlier... We'll never be as comfortable at sea as on land.

Of course, many of those scars you see on the marine mammals are from prop strikes and entanglements in fishing gear...
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Old 04-12-2012, 16:41   #506
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Um, the Atlantic Ocean is pretty big? How's that for an explanation?
Second try at this.........

You think a orange survival outfit with an LED strobe would not be seen by now?
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Old 04-12-2012, 17:03   #507
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Re: Merged Threads: HMS Bounty

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While I appreciate your point, I have to disagree with that as well. In the Ocean unless you are an apex predator EVERYTHING is trying to eat you.Ever looked closely at any marine mammal? I don't think I've ever seen a seal, dolphin or Whale without some pretty significant scars
Put a naked man in the brush and he'll have scars too. My point is we adapt ourselves to our environment let alone having the ability to modify our environment.

Put clothes on that naked man and he is less prone to suffer cuts and scratches. Give him a set of tools and he can alter his environment. We don't go to sea (or the air or space or the outback) without first embarking upon preparation. We have the ability to prepare ourselves to a point far beyond what nature provides.
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Old 04-12-2012, 17:09   #508
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Re: Merged Threads: HMS Bounty

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Second try at this.........

You think a orange survival outfit with an LED strobe would not be seen by now?
The ocean is huge. Even with computer modeling which accurately predicts winds and currents, it is incredibly difficult to locate something on the sea. Then we must consider that they may have flown in sight of the missing captain. It can be incredibly difficult to spot a person on the waters...even when they wear the necessary rescue gear...even when the observers knows what to look for. This is why it is so vitally important than when crew on deck spot something they keep eyes on. Take your eyes off target even briefly and it may well be quite difficult to reacquire.
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Old 04-12-2012, 17:55   #509
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Re: Merged Threads: HMS Bounty

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I get the feeling from the article that the engineer wasn't a ship experienced one and that there had been recent fuel tank work done.
"He had sailed a few times before, but he had never been responsible for the engine room of such a large ship." Profoundly inexperienced.

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So far I haven't read anything that suggests the boat was taking on more water due to hull damage from the storm.
You think it was a coincidence? Wow.

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Old 04-12-2012, 18:10   #510
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Re: Merged Threads: HMS Bounty

You would never find the body if he decided to stay in the ship.

There's no reports of him being on deck when they abandoned.
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