Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 03-11-2012, 11:25   #406
Senior Cruiser
 
Blue Stocking's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: St. Georges, Bda
Boat: Rhodes Reliant 41ft
Posts: 4,117
Re: Merged Threads: HMS Bounty

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dockhead View Post
A charitable interpretation, and maybe even right

Thanks for that - I would really like to think that's what it was all about. . .
+1
__________________

__________________
so many projects--so little time !!
Blue Stocking is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-11-2012, 11:55   #407
Registered User
 
GaryMayo's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Branched Oak Yacht Club, Wife is an Admiral in the Nebraska Navy
Boat: Clipper Marine 32 CC Aft Cabin Ketch
Posts: 1,211
Quote:
Originally Posted by Panope
In the Video posted previously, The Captain was interviewed and said:

"We chase hurricanes" (said with a smile).
"We get a good ride out of it" (chasing hurricanes).
"70 waves were not uncomfortable"
"The engines are undersized"
"We sail to our destinations"
"Square riggers do not go to windward"
"The fastest speed we have seen was 12 knots under bare poles in 95m.p.h. wids"

Is it possible that the captain viewed the coming hurricane with its strong southerly winds as an opportunity (for traveling south) not to be missed?

Steve
Very good post pointing out the mindset of the captain just weeks before this tragic event. Maybe he thought he could break his previous speed record.
__________________

__________________
W.I.B. Crealock when asked what he thought of the easily trailerable Clipper Marine sailboats by a naval design collegue, Gentelman Bill responded, "I am very proud of them".
www.clippermarine.org & www.clipper-sailor.net
GaryMayo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-11-2012, 12:17   #408
Registered User
 
sabray's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2008
Location: Wash DC
Boat: PETERSON 44
Posts: 3,169
Watched the video. Then watched the lorax. Came to mind " that's a reporter" substitute women for reporter.
__________________
sabray is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-11-2012, 12:52   #409
Registered User
 
Gene :^)'s Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2008
Boat: 1914 Fantail M.Y. "Strathbelle"
Posts: 223
It seems to me that if all the crew wanted to go on the trip and none were forced in any way, then there is no wrong doing here.

Many people are thrill seekers and I see no problem with that. If I wanted to go out in rough weather, I wouldn't want anyone telling me I cannot just because they wouldn't.

Surfers go out in dangerous storm surf for giant waves, putting lives in danger.
Race car drivers go way faster than what is considered safe, putting lives in danger.
People climb Mt Everest in horrid conditions, putting lives in danger.
People jump out of perfectly good airplanes, putting lives in danger.
Stunt pilots and Blue Angels do dangerous acrobatics, putting lives in danger.
People try to cross oceans in sub standard vessels, putting lives in danger.
People sail in Arctic waters or ice filled waters in fiberglass boats, putting lives in danger.

With only the details we currently know, I feel the captain was very experienced and did a fantastic routing job. I wish I were as able and confident as he. He was past the storm and I was impressed with his navigation around it.

He was captain of a ship, not a boat like most of us. The ship had already proven herself in similar conditions and I would think the captain had no doubt in her ability to make this trip. Ships can take much more than we think.

-----

Gene :^)
Http://www.Strathbelle.com/
__________________
Gene :^)

1914 Fantail Motor Yacht of Riveted Iron & Steel
http://www.Strathbelle.com
Gene :^) is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-11-2012, 13:03   #410
Registered User
 
xymotic's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,076
Re: Merged Threads: HMS Bounty

Blue Angels, Everest Climbers, Sky Divers do NOT go out in Bad Weather. Racers dramatically alter their equipment AND speed before the slightest hint of rain, and when surfers and other go out in Hurricanes the result is usually predictable.
__________________
xymotic is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-11-2012, 13:21   #411
Registered User
 
Gene :^)'s Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2008
Boat: 1914 Fantail M.Y. "Strathbelle"
Posts: 223
Quote:
Originally Posted by xymotic
Blue Angels, Everest Climbers, Sky Divers do NOT go out in Bad Weather. Racers dramatically alter their equipment AND speed before the slightest hint of rain, and when surfers and other go out in Hurricanes the result is usually predictable.
You missed the point, going out in bad weather was most likely the "thrill" they were looking for. Getting to Florida was just a destination.

People do dangerous things for the thrill.


-----

Gene :^)
Http://www.Strathbelle.com/
__________________
Gene :^)

1914 Fantail Motor Yacht of Riveted Iron & Steel
http://www.Strathbelle.com
Gene :^) is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-11-2012, 13:33   #412
cruiser

Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Tampa Bay area
Boat: Hunter 31'
Posts: 5,731
Re: Merged Threads: HMS Bounty

Quote:
Originally Posted by Svan View Post
Some points of fact.

The indecision by the NWS about whether to call Sandy a hurricane related solely to its source of energy. Hurricanes, as tropical cyclones, draw energy from the warm ocean. Ordinary storms draw their energy from the temperature differentials in the atmosphere. This change happened when the hurricane merged with a sizeable low-pressure system.

You can see the storm bulk up nearly 2-3x in diameter while it's abeam Florida: SANDY Graphics Archive sometime on Friday. That must have been an oh-**** moment aboard Bounty.

The question about when to depart the boat may have been influenced by darkness. The first distress call was at 1830, the order to abandon given at 0400.

That wasn't indecision on the part of the NWS. They called the storm "extra-tropical" and *urged* people to recognize that it did NOT mean the storm had weakened, and that in fact it was already in some ways worse and that this worsening was expected to continue. Whatever what went wrong, it doesn't lie at the feet of NWS or NOAA.
__________________
Rakuflames is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-11-2012, 13:36   #413
cruiser

Join Date: Aug 2011
Location: Tampa Bay area
Boat: Hunter 31'
Posts: 5,731
Re: Merged Threads: HMS Bounty

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gene :^) View Post
It seems to me that if all the crew wanted to go on the trip and none were forced in any way, then there is no wrong doing here.

Many people are thrill seekers and I see no problem with that. If I wanted to go out in rough weather, I wouldn't want anyone telling me I cannot just because they wouldn't.

Surfers go out in dangerous storm surf for giant waves, putting lives in danger.
Race car drivers go way faster than what is considered safe, putting lives in danger.
People climb Mt Everest in horrid conditions, putting lives in danger.
People jump out of perfectly good airplanes, putting lives in danger.
Stunt pilots and Blue Angels do dangerous acrobatics, putting lives in danger.
People try to cross oceans in sub standard vessels, putting lives in danger.
People sail in Arctic waters or ice filled waters in fiberglass boats, putting lives in danger.

With only the details we currently know, I feel the captain was very experienced and did a fantastic routing job. I wish I were as able and confident as he. He was past the storm and I was impressed with his navigation around it.

He was captain of a ship, not a boat like most of us. The ship had already proven herself in similar conditions and I would think the captain had no doubt in her ability to make this trip. Ships can take much more than we think.

-----

Gene :^)
Http://www.Strathbelle.com/



You said that so well. That is exactly why I'm withholding judgment. What we do is dangerous. it's not as dangerous as, say, climbing Mt. Everest, but it's dangerous.
__________________
Rakuflames is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-11-2012, 13:42   #414
Registered User
 
thompsonisland's Avatar

Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Georgetown, Maine
Boat: 1939 Crocker 37
Posts: 164
Not suggesting that anyone is blaming the weather service, but we've seen some alarming instances of that historically and recently, as in the Italian earthquake inquiry. To my mind this is an extremely dangerous idea, a "shoot the messenger" mentality that seeks to assign blame for individual choices outside of those individuals, or assume blame for bad luck.
__________________
thompsonisland is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-11-2012, 15:00   #415
Registered User
 
Svan's Avatar

Join Date: Nov 2011
Location: Toronto
Boat: PDQ Capella 36
Posts: 59
I wish to clarify that in no way did the the NHC show indecision. The media took the issue sideways, however.
__________________
Svan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 03-11-2012, 15:03   #416
TEE
Registered User

Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 139
Re: Merged Threads: HMS Bounty

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gene :^) View Post
It seems to me that if all the crew wanted to go on the trip and none were forced in any way, then there is no wrong doing here.

Many people are thrill seekers and I see no problem with that. If I wanted to go out in rough weather, I wouldn't want anyone telling me I cannot just because they wouldn't.

Surfers go out in dangerous storm surf for giant waves, putting lives in danger.
Race car drivers go way faster than what is considered safe, putting lives in danger.
People climb Mt Everest in horrid conditions, putting lives in danger.
People jump out of perfectly good airplanes, putting lives in danger.
Stunt pilots and Blue Angels do dangerous acrobatics, putting lives in danger.
People try to cross oceans in sub standard vessels, putting lives in danger.
People sail in Arctic waters or ice filled waters in fiberglass boats, putting lives in danger.

With only the details we currently know, I feel the captain was very experienced and did a fantastic routing job. I wish I were as able and confident as he. He was past the storm and I was impressed with his navigation around it.

He was captain of a ship, not a boat like most of us. The ship had already proven herself in similar conditions and I would think the captain had no doubt in her ability to make this trip. Ships can take much more than we think.

-----

Gene :^)
Http://www.Strathbelle.com/
Well, gee. I guess if I am walking down the docks, and I see anybody with a t-shirt that reads, "I intentionally sailed into Sandy, and all I got was nearly drowned and this stupid t-shirt," I will know they were on the crew.
__________________
TEE is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-11-2012, 05:57   #417
Registered User
 
Feral Cement's Avatar

Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: North Carolina, USA
Boat: Tartan 34C
Posts: 583
Re: Merged Threads: HMS Bounty

Quote:
Originally Posted by David_Old_Jersey View Post
In some scenarios it may make more sense to put the most physically (and mentally?) able into a raft / lifeboat first - and that may be a man or a woman, but more likely to be a man........
You're on your own in dangerous waters, mate. Been nice knowin' ya.
__________________
Feral Cement is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-11-2012, 11:25   #418
Registered User
 
micah719's Avatar

Join Date: Jul 2012
Location: Somewhere in Germany
Boat: OEM, proportional
Posts: 1,439
Re: Merged Threads: HMS Bounty

He's oiling up his tap-dancing shoes now......
__________________
Ps 139:9-10 If I take the wings of the morning, and dwell in the uttermost parts of the sea; Even there shall thy hand lead me, and thy right hand shall hold me.
micah719 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-11-2012, 13:22   #419
cat herder, extreme blacksheep
 
zeehag's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jul 2008
Location: furycame alley , tropics, mexico for now
Boat: 1976 FORMOSA yankee clipper 41
Posts: 17,777
Images: 56
Send a message via Yahoo to zeehag Send a message via Skype™ to zeehag
Re: Merged Threads: HMS Bounty

nhc showed sandy as a hurricane until after it beat new jersey to pieces.
zeehag is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-11-2012, 15:29   #420
Registered User
 
Reefmagnet's Avatar

Join Date: May 2008
Location: puɐןsuǝǝnb 'ʎɐʞɔɐɯ
Boat: Nantucket Island 33
Posts: 2,737
Re: Merged Threads: HMS Bounty

Around these parts, we have problems with people driving across flooded bridges and causeways resulting in their cars being washed off the road leading to, in some cases, fatalities. This is not just people driving blindly into flood waters in the middle of the night during a torrential downpour, but rather people making conscious decisions to attempt the crossing. In fact, it is such a problem the authorities have ramped up the fine and also instigated a media campaign in an effort to minimise the instances of this happening. The problem is caused by a combination of familiarity, over confidence, the "need" to reach the destination with minimal delays and a "she'll be right mate, it's only a couple of inches higher than last time we crossed" attitude.

I would guess, and it's only my guess, that it was thinking along much the same lines that placed the Bounty in sufficient enough peril to initiate the chain of events that ultimately caused her to founder.
__________________

__________________
Reefmagnet is online now   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
crew, hurricane

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
You Can Own the 'H.M.S. Bounty' . . . No, Really! TaoJones Monohull Sailboats 39 01-09-2011 09:37



Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 20:35.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.