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Old 01-06-2012, 09:00   #481
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Re: Laura Dekker's Circumnavigation

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Mexico and almost every other Latin America country for starters.
At the risk of coming off culturally insensitive, I would ask, is it by choice? or as a result of some socioeconomic necessity and/or obligation placed upon them? Context is important, especially in determining whether something is right, wrong, or a necessary shade of gray.

Back to the thread. There is a huge difference between sailing around the world at 16, and raising a family. When she first wanted to embark on her adventure one, maybe two, years ago. I was for it. Because it was a young person seeking an adventure and a pursuit for exploration. Something rare in today's day and age.

Don't miss-understand me. I'm not knocking this thread. My reply was was in defense of those who may express uneasiness with certain specific aspects of certain posts. I only gave my example of what made me a little uncomfortable to put the same into the proper context, instead of just saying "I don't like this."

Just being fair to everyone.
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Old 01-06-2012, 09:16   #482
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Re: Laura Dekker's Circumnavigation

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I never liked this type of argument as I feel it's self serving and insensitive. Different people have different perspectives and levels of comfort, and it's unfair to tell them "it's obviously just your problem."

To their defense, I'll say that I jumped through a few pages on this thread, and to be honest, The thread started off innocent enough, but along the way it seemed to morph into a strange form of idolization.

It's an age issue. I just think this particular sailor is too young to have her pictures and every step posted by third parties, when she herself does not have a voice on this thread. Maybe if this sailor was older and/or was posting the material herself, I would feel differently.

Happy Sailing!!!
Now these concerns I can fully understand, and has caused me to look inward as to why I am such a fan. There are so many reasons conspiring to make me a fan of Laura's, a bullet point presentation is in order.

1) Like her, I felt the constraints of lake sailing at an early age.

2) Unlike her, I didn't have the confidence in myself after reading "Dove" by Robin Graham, to go out and do it.

3) Enjoyed the sea so much, in my mid 40's went back to school, CMA, to turn a passion into a job.

4) Had to accept an early ending to my career, to take care of my dad, also ending an active life, to one of a shut-in.

5) Dad happened to enjoy the exploits of Jessica and Abby.

6) Through staying in contact with Dutch work colleagues, was informed that the "real deal" of young sailors was getting ready for her voyage.

7) Then the news that her government has stepped in to stop her. I thought how arrogant of a government, they know nothing about sailing or her sailing ability. I knew from what my fellow Merchant Marine Deck Officers (#6 above) have told me, she was more capable than 99% of cruisers currently out there.

The above is my reasons for having a keen interest in Laura, so for those that think it is "creepy", if you are able to put yourself in someone else's shoes to examine motives, please do so instead of jumping to conclusions.
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Old 01-06-2012, 09:36   #483
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Re: Laura Dekker's Circumnavigation

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The above is my reasons for having a keen interest in Laura, so for those that think it is "creepy", if you are able to put yourself in someone else's shoes to examine motives, please do so instead of jumping to conclusions.

Deckofficer, I hope you did not take any of my posts to be any form of attack or jibe to you. I empathize with you to the best of my abilities. I do understand that sometimes life put us in a position where we need to make decisions that compromise our own desires for the well being and benefit of those we care about. You dialing back on your dream to care for your father is beyond commendable, and I hope you take great pride from being a strong and great son.

It sounds like both you and your dad are able to have fun and successfully use blogs to help release stress and carry on together. If it works, you should continue to do so to your hearts content. Also, keep this thread active. I'll stay subbed

All the best to you and your father. I hope he recovers and regains his strength so you both can return the sea and her flowing embrace.

Cheers!!!!
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Old 01-06-2012, 09:48   #484
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Re: Laura Dekker's Circumnavigation

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Originally Posted by SailingwithSoul View Post
I never liked this type of argument as I feel it's self serving and insensitive. Different people have different perspectives and levels of comfort, and it's unfair to tell them "it's obviously just your problem."
Sensitivity noted. And I truly do not mean that sarcastically, as I know it could be taken that way.

Quote:
To their defense, I'll say that I jumped through a few pages on this thread, and to be honest, The thread started off innocent enough, but along the way it seemed to morph into a strange form of idolization.

It's an age issue. I just think this particular sailor is too young to have her pictures and every step posted by third parties, when she herself does not have a voice on this thread. Maybe if this sailor was older and/or was posting the material herself, I would feel differently.

Happy Sailing!!!
Virtually all is coming from her blogs or facebook postings, which are her own. We are getting the Reader's Digest snap shots. I for one appreciate them.

I personally see Laura as having a maturity level that exceeds a lot of adults. And obviously, she also has a touch of teenager left too. Great kid, if she was mine, I would be immensely proud of her. Just as I am of my daughter who decided to ski across the Columbia Icefields, climb Mt. Columbia, rappel down a crevice, and call it a long weekend fun adventure. And yes, Dad was concerned, but she is an experienced mountaineer. Mind you, she was not 16 when she did that, but I am sure the dad feelings are the same for her dad.
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Old 01-06-2012, 09:52   #485
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Re: Laura Dekker's Circumnavigation

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She's 16. Where are they having/raising families at that age?
africa, india, china, most of south america, from the urals eastwards, middle east, etc. about 2/3 of the worlds population. work life also starts around 10 years old in these countries. we tend to forget how lucky we are to live in extreme wealth where humans dont really have to work till their twenties, starving to death is not a daily neighborhood occurance, and females have access to health care. gee, we even think extreme wealth is having millions when in most of the world having $500 bucks is considered wealthy. of course that all may change soon.
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Old 01-06-2012, 09:57   #486
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Re: Laura Dekker's Circumnavigation

Thanks Sailing with Soul. It was not directed at you at all, but I chose to quote you as a person that was able to put into words your concern, rather than the attack of a couple of other posters. Had those other posters been as eloquent as you in posting their concerns, I would have replied to them.

I appreciate your thoughts for my dad's recovery, but it isn't any illness, just the age related dementia of someone that is 93 years old. He is a great old guy, used to race bicycles till the age of 85, and was always a very good father to me. What goes around, comes around, and even though I didn't get to sail on my CMA education for as long as I would have liked, the 100,000's of nm did whet my appetite for more, but will be of my choosing and time frame, not that of the shipping company. Among all the activities that dad introduced me to, sailing was one he wasn't comfortable with for himself, as he wasn't a strong or confident swimmer. After learning to sail from him, that left me at age 10 to sail by myself.

As to posting of Laura's pictures, I'm sure you are aware that for most of them I am simply re-posting from her site, as Hammond always points out. I have some pictures given to me by my cruising friends that have had the pleasure of meeting her on her travels and cooking her a meal or two. In the future, if she posts any picture of herself, that in the mind of a very conservative person could be thought of as provocative, I will refrain from re-posting it here.

Cheers mate
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Old 01-06-2012, 19:45   #487
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I am so sorry to say but in the USA as well. I am a school counselor & have taught for nearly 25 years and have seen too many pregnant teens. I am in Los Angeles right now but also worked in Nevada and Utah. It is usually when kids have not much support at home but it happens in the best homes as well.

The saddest case was a 14 yr old girl in Nevada who told me when wearing lacy, anklet socks (a fashion craze at the time). I felt sick to my stomach to hear the pain. Her single father worked night at the local mine (it was short jobs so he was lucky to have any job). She found companionship by having parties while dad worked. Life is tough for some kids. Laura has a ton of support of family, friends and a country or two. She is an amazingly, lucky girl who I bet can take care of herself quite well. Gloria
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Old 02-06-2012, 05:43   #488
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Re: Laura Dekker's Circumnavigation

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Thanks Sailing with Soul. It was not directed at you at all, but I chose to quote you as a person that was able to put into words your concern, rather than the attack of a couple of other posters. Had those other posters been as eloquent as you in posting their concerns, I would have replied to them.

I appreciate your thoughts for my dad's recovery, but it isn't any illness, just the age related dementia of someone that is 93 years old. He is a great old guy, used to race bicycles till the age of 85, and was always a very good father to me. What goes around, comes around, and even though I didn't get to sail on my CMA education for as long as I would have liked, the 100,000's of nm did whet my appetite for more, but will be of my choosing and time frame, not that of the shipping company. Among all the activities that dad introduced me to, sailing was one he wasn't comfortable with for himself, as he wasn't a strong or confident swimmer. After learning to sail from him, that left me at age 10 to sail by myself.

As to posting of Laura's pictures, I'm sure you are aware that for most of them I am simply re-posting from her site, as Hammond always points out. I have some pictures given to me by my cruising friends that have had the pleasure of meeting her on her travels and cooking her a meal or two. In the future, if she posts any picture of herself, that in the mind of a very conservative person could be thought of as provocative, I will refrain from re-posting it here.

Cheers mate
doubt if a very conservative person would be into cruising. or it would be a very short lived experience. cruising broadens one's mind, not narrows it. in today's world, if one is very conservative, likely to be in a state of denial. so ignore them. btw: the japanese marketing groups use caucasian models ages 5-12 from america to model everything from clothing to drinks. made up to look like adults. the japanese go for the skin tone and baby face facial features. the chinese are just getting started doing this. big money for the kids.
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Old 02-06-2012, 07:05   #489
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Re: Laura Dekker's Circumnavigation

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doubt if a very conservative person would be into cruising. or it would be a very short lived experience.
I reckon that says more about your personal biases than it does about conservative values.
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Old 02-06-2012, 07:59   #490
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Re: Laura Dekker's Circumnavigation

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I reckon that says more about your personal biases than it does about conservative values.
Now I'm confused. Isn't conservative values just a PC term for personal biases?

Back on topic, Laura and remaining crew left San Cristobal this morning, next stop the Marquesas, currently running at 2 kt, which is fine by her as she declared she would not be going as fast this time around.
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Old 02-06-2012, 08:11   #491
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Re: Laura Dekker's Circumnavigation

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I reckon that says more about your personal biases than it does about conservative values.
not really, just based on 50 years of traveling this globe. people of the sea, regardless of cultures, tend to have a "live and let live" attitude, at least more than land based folks, imho. often saw hindi and muslim sailors getting along real well in the bay of bengal while their landsfolks were killing each other. similar experiences in other parts of the globe. obviously not talking about "yachties" nor weekend sailors but those who cruise as a lifestyle; not dabblers in the sea, which are basically landsmen who sometimes get their toes wet. laura is a real seaperson who probably will continue to offend very conservative soil based humans. good for her!
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Old 02-06-2012, 08:21   #492
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Yeah, I have to resist the temptation to get distracted by that really obnoxious post that there can't possibly be any narrow-minded conservatives on the high seas, and all Japanese and Chinese are subconsciously pedophiles. Wow.

I think Laura triggers a kean interest on some oddly personal level because for almost every member on here we can remember our own teen dreams of some great adventure, almost always deferred. She touches something that was nestled very deeply in our 16 year old heads that never completely disappears.
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Old 02-06-2012, 08:27   #493
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Re: Laura Dekker's Circumnavigation

I'm pretty sure Laura has never lived in a home on land, just wasn't in dad's budget. Some may not know that Laura and her dad are poor by the standards of the land dwelling general population.

Being conservative by itself isn't a negative, but pushing conservative values onto others is.
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Old 02-06-2012, 08:29   #494
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Re: Laura Dekker's Circumnavigation

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I think Laura triggers a kean interest on some oddly personal level because for almost every member on here we can remember our own teen dreams of some great adventure, almost always deferred. She touches something that was nestled very deeply in our 16 year old heads that never completely disappears.
That is me in spades.
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Old 02-06-2012, 09:03   #495
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Re: Laura Dekker's Circumnavigation

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Yeah, I have to resist the temptation to get distracted by that really obnoxious post that there can't possibly be any narrow-minded conservatives on the high seas, and all Japanese and Chinese are subconsciously pedophiles. Wow.

I think Laura triggers a kean interest on some oddly personal level because for almost every member on here we can remember our own teen dreams of some great adventure, almost always deferred. She touches something that was nestled very deeply in our 16 year old heads that never completely disappears.
talk about projecting one's values!! yikes. the term " conservative" means way more than a political affiliation, if it ever meant that. it means a desire to keep things the way they "were". a traditionalist. has nothing to do with "narrowmindedness" but more a fixed set of values and attitudes grounded in tradition. this applies to any political affiliation.

as far as asians go, its got nothing to do with any subconsciousness. that is an american pathological fixation. good heavens. kids in asia are by and large spoiled, loved over, and honored. but they also must work. asians do have a fixation on western facial features: round eyes, chubby cheeks, and soft hair. think your subconscious is working overtime.
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