Defender warehouse workers on strike

[sailnow2011]

If the already overpriced defender raises prices, they will be done.
Many other places to get stuff online for much less.
You people who still shop there need to shop around. Name a product, and I will find it for you for less money someplace else. Try me.

[Jman]

Bstreep,

Re: appraisal being unionized. The word is sarcasm.


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[skipmac]

Originally Posted by Boatguy30

And 6 errors does seem like a bunch looking down from the ivory towers, but how much extra time do you suppose they're allotted to double check their work?

45 years ago I worked pulling and packing orders at a wholesale record warehouse. Typical orders would vary from 5-50 different singles and albums, from 1-50 copies of each record. Each employee filled dozens of orders each day and mistakes were extremely rare, as in almost non existent.

This is shipping products where each item looked about the same IE 12"X12", differing only by the cover art, unlike boat stuff where a pump will not in any way resemble a shackle nor a halyard resemble a block. So from someone that's been there, done that 6 errors seems fairly generous.

[Jon Eisberg]

Originally Posted by sailnow2011

If the already overpriced defender raises prices, they will be done.
Many other places to get stuff online for much less.
You people who still shop there need to shop around. Name a product, and I will find it for you for less money someplace else. Try me.

Yeah, their days are probably numbered, for sure... Despite having become perhaps the largest retailer of inflatable boats in North America, surely they can't last much longer... ;-)

In my memory, at least here on the NE/Mid-Atlantic, they have already outlasted Bliss Marine, E&B, M&E, and Boat US, just to name the first that come to mind...

Jamestown Distributors and Hamilton Marine can't possibly hang on much longer either, I hear those Maine lobstermen are already flocking to Ailbaba for their gear... It's not like those guys might ever need to have anything immediately, after all...

;-)

[skipmac]

Originally Posted by Jon Eisberg

Yeah, their days are probably numbered, for sure... Despite having become perhaps the largest retailer of inflatable boats in North America, surely they can't last much longer... ;-)

In my memory, at least here on the NE/Mid-Atlantic, they have already outlasted Bliss Marine, E&B, M&E, and Boat US, just to name the first that come to mind...

Jamestown Distributors and Hamilton Marine can't possibly hang on much longer either, I hear those Maine lobstermen are already flocking to Ailbaba for their gear...

;-)

Careful. Your tongue might get stuck in your cheek.

[amytom]

Originally Posted by sailnow2011

If the already overpriced defender raises prices, they will be done.
Many other places to get stuff online for much less.
You people who still shop there need to shop around. Name a product, and I will find it for you for less money someplace else. Try me.

Okay here's one:
Lewmar DC1 double rope clutch for small line 1/4"-5/16" paid 102.11 when I ordered from defender night before last. If you can find it cheaper and educate me I would be grateful.

Tom



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[sailnow2011]

Originally Posted by amytom

Okay here's one:
Lewmar DC1 double rope clutch for small line 1/4"-5/16" paid 102.11 when I ordered from defender night before last. If you can find it cheaper and educate me I would be grateful.

Tom

Here is a D2 for less then $85
Lewmar New D2 12 14 Double Clutch C1 29102414 | eBay

Lewmar has MAP, sort of like raymarine and garmin.
List for less the MAP and they stop sending you product.

[amytom]

Originally Posted by sailnow2011

Here is a D2 for less then $85
Lewmar New D2 12 14 Double Clutch C1 29102414 | eBay

Lewmar has MAP, sort of like raymarine and garmin.
List for less the MAP and they stop sending you product.

Good find at a good price. Not exactly what I wanted though as I need the one for the smaller lines 1/4"-5/16".
Your point is taken though and I will search longer next time.


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[crazyoldboatguy]

I just placed a large order with Defender @ 2 pm today (central time) and it was filled and shipped before close of business. Won't know if it was correct or I get it in a timely manner next week. Hadn't even known they were on strike until I saw this.

I've been in 4 unions - AFSCME is the one I am in now. No choice - if I want this job I have to be in a union. Was a welder - Boilermakers. The heads of the union played golf with the CEO, etc. Pay was crap, conditions were crap. Dues were automatically deducted. Then I was in the Aerospace/Machinists union. No steward in the shop - no one from the union EVER visited the shop. Then I was in the Sheetmetal Workers union. The owner of the company chose the shop steward. I. Am. Not. Lying. The dues are ALWAYS deducted from the paycheck.

Historically, the unions accomplished much. Most of it enshrined in in US law with agencies, OSHA, NLRB, EEOC, etc protecting employee rights. Don't like the pay - LEAVE. Warehouse work is unskilled. Not easy, just unskilled. Lesson to all you slacker kids out there. Stay in school, get an education, supervise the drop outs.

I work in Illinois. The union employees are working without a contract. A strike looms. The union is TOTALLY unprepared for this. There is NO strike fund. I am about to retire. My last time at the job may well be as a scab, crossing the picket line to get the last days I need to get to retirement age. I won't stay one minute longer. I ain't getting any younger and I have a boat to finish.

[Pelagic]

I have only worked in a Union once in my life ....in Plywood mills (IWA) from junior High School thru University on weekends and holidays.

Because the IWA regularly would go on strikes during the Sumner Months it was a frustrating experience as I needed the income for tuition.

Luckily because of the production skills I had developed, I was hired by a Non-Union company (Richmond Plywood) whose shareholders also worked in the plant.

What a positive difference ... where at Richmond, the attitude towards maximizing production while minimizing waste was far superior as was the benefits to those of us who were not shareholders.

It definitely taught me how well people perform when given an opportunity to work for themselves.
In 5 years I saw share value increase from $7k to $32k as they would scoop up the Union Mill contracts lost during strikes.

[Hobie_ind]

I'm looking to order a couple things from Defender to have shipped to me here in Fiji. I read through the thread solely to find up-to-date info on their shipping, but in the end all I really got was just more insight on why North America (and Europe) is going to continue to struggle to compete globally. We're wildly contradictory between what we say and what we do as a culture I believe, and the posts here I think are a great example of it.

I think this is less about union/non-union issues than it is about a business (and industry in fact) trying to figure out how to survive with a customer base that largely doesn't appreciate them trying to maintain, local quality customer support, good selection and inventory close to their customers (and providing jobs at home instead of overseas) rather than relying on cheap energy to wing individual widgets halfway around the world on an individual basis.

As a rule, our culture continues to lust after the newest gadget at the cheapest price and then blame 'big business' or 'greedy business owners' for building or sourcing overseas as the North American business and manufacturing sector flounders to keep pace while we saddle them with higher demands for wages and benefits that we won't pay for because we found the same part 1/2 way around the world for a few bucks cheaper.

We also frankly do this, knowing that the workers there generally enjoy a far lower standard of living than we'd ever tolerate and it's likely manufactured to environmental standards that we'd scream about if it were at home. But few think about that when they're saving a few bucks on a 'luxury' item (yes, unless you're a fisherman or similar, it's really a luxury item, not an essential). I get just as frustrated when I hear folks complaining about WalMart crushing the local businessman, but then when they boycott the local WalMart they'll talk about how cheap they got it from Amazon! To be clear, I'm not a big fan of unions and I also think work ethic is also rapidly declining in North America that compounds everything above.

Sorry for the rant!!!!.....I guess I got frustrated sorting through 7 pages lookig for up to date shipping experience, so thought I'd contradict myself and join the fray!

Now......here's hoping Defender's still shipping on a timely basis!

[phantomracer]

Originally Posted by Pelagic

I have only worked in a Union once in my life ....in Plywood mills (IWA) from junior High School thru University on weekends and holidays.

Because the IWA regularly would go on strikes during the Sumner Months it was a frustrating experience as I needed the income for tuition.

Luckily because of the production skills I had developed, I was hired by a Non-Union company (Richmond Plywood) whose shareholders also worked in the plant.

What a positive difference ... where at Richmond, the attitude towards maximizing production while minimizing waste was far superior as was the benefits to those of us who were not shareholders.

It definitely taught me how well people perform when given an opportunity to work for themselves.
In 5 years I saw share value increase from $7k to $32k as they would scoop up the Union Mill contracts lost during strikes.

Ditto, as a kid worked at Nynex in a union. There was always a US and THEM attitude. Still have it where I am now in the union job I have, but to a lesser extent.

When I worked in a non-union shop, I got better raises (based on performance, not because I had a pulse). The attitude was better, WE worked together There was no us and them attitude. When management asked me to work as a cashier in the store during a strike, I did it with pride that I was helping the company.

My job now, because we are in a union, everyone gets the same raise regardless if you were a marginal worker or a superlative worker. There is no incentive to excel or do extra as you are not rewarded for doing good work.

[Jon Eisberg]

Originally Posted by zboss

Not really... Alibaba is a Chinese company owned by a gentleman named Jack Ma. Kind of line a Chinese Amazon. This company made him the 18th richest person in the world in just about 5 years. I ordered several engine parts for my boat from his company last year. They were 1/2 the price of what I found in the US and included 2 day shipping from China. Within one hour of placing an order from them I also ordered some stuff from Defender. I tracked my delivery from China to California to Florida and it arrived in 2 days... 3 days later by Defender order came in. My parts were perfect and direct from the factory that makes them for Mitsubishi.

Well, I expect Defender will somehow manage to keep their doors open for a few more months, at least...

Not sure their customers will be flocking to order from Alibaba at the moment...

;-)

Alibaba's Wipeout Leaves Investors Questioning What Comes Next - Bloomberg Business

[Capt Gary]

I used to live 3 miles down the road from Defender and got very spoiled living so close. I moved out of the area in April and didn't hear about the strike. I doubt very much if they are close to going out of business though because they just built a significant addition onto their office, showroom and warehouse areas. I have always found their prices to be very competitive.

[Cormorant]

They settled their differences a few weeks ago and signed a contract. Not clear if anyone really "won."

[Capt Gary -- I grew up near Pleasure Beach, also just a few miles down the road....]

The Day - Defender Industries, warehouse workers reach accord - News from southeastern Connecticut

Defender Industries, warehouse workers reach accord

Published November 09. 2015 4:11PM
By Brian Hallenbeck


Waterford — Defender Industries and unionized warehouse workers who last summer staged a strike against the boating-equipment supplier have agreed to a first-ever contract, officials for both sides confirmed Monday.
Stephan Lance, the company's president, said the four-year contract has been “officially ratified” and was in the process of being signed. He said the contract would apply to 29 warehouse workers represented by Local 493 of the Teamsters union.
The warehouse workers had voted to affiliate with the Uncasville-based local in November 2014.
“We succeeded in reaching a hard-fought contract,” said Tom Schlink, Local 493’s secretary-treasurer. He declined to comment further. Details on pay raises were not provided.
The workers staged a strike Sept. 4, picketing outside Defender’s main entrance on Great Neck Road. Strike participants complained publicly about a company discipline policy that they regarded as too strict and said led to firings following the union vote. Wages were also a point of contention.
Lance said Monday that some of the strikers returned to work the day after the strike began and that about 70 percent of them came back “within three to four days.” He said more eventually returned and that “some chose not to return.”
He said the discipline policy was not an issue during contract negotiations.
“So I don’t know how concerned about it (discipline) they could have been if it didn’t come up in yearlong bargaining discussions,” Lance said.
Founded in New York City in 1938, Defender, a family-owned business, moved to Waterford from New Rochelle, N.Y., in 1996. In Waterford, its 110,000-square-foot warehouse includes an outlet store.
Defender employs 126 people during peak business periods, according to Lance. Currently, it has 112 workers, incudling part-timers. The warehouse workers are the only ones affiliated with a union.