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Old 11-11-2011, 04:45   #346
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Re: Crew of SV 'Sanctuary' Abandon Ship

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However, the subject boat of this thread DIDN'T survive its storm. Would some other boat have survived the same conditions? Who knows? But more robust construction might well have done the trick.
Actually it did survive the storm, it was the crew that wanted off.

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. They are of a Bennie that had a collision with a steel boat, and was brought to the Yamba marina in NSW for repairs. It didn't sink, but it was a near thing
Funny again the boat didnt sink. What in the name of god does your argument prove, would GRP Hinckley ( now no longer made) survive any different I doubt it.

All this shows is that steel boats are stronger in a collision then GRP, whoes disputing that.

These arguments are fatuous, The fact is reality disputes what you say. Virtually everyone has converted to fin keel and spade rudder, even stalwarts like HR. You'll be arguing the steam engine was superior next.


Its a form of elitism really (ogh Jim look, one of those horrible Bendys has got into our yacht club whatever will we do....)

Dave
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Old 11-11-2011, 05:56   #347
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Re: Crew of SV 'Sanctuary' Abandon Ship

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Originally Posted by goboatingnow View Post

Its a form of elitism really (ogh Jim look, one of those horrible Bendys has got into our yacht club whatever will we do....)

Dave
Just when I was thinking there was nothing left to learn on this thread!


I've written this a number of times on this thread, but we still know nothing about where/why the boat was taking on water! So to start a "it was sinking because it was a crappy production boat" bunch of posts is just bull!

And to me the boat wasn't sinking! It was taking on some water that the crew was keeping up. I'm not saying they did/didn't make the correct decision to abandon ship as that is not my or anyone else's place to say!
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Old 11-11-2011, 06:10   #348
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Re: Crew of SV 'Sanctuary' Abandon Ship

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Just when I was thinking there was nothing left to learn on this thread!


I've written this a number of times on this thread, but we still know nothing about where/why the boat was taking on water! So to start a "it was sinking because it was a crappy production boat" bunch of posts is just bull!

And to me the boat wasn't sinking! It was taking on some water that the crew was keeping up. I'm not saying they did/didn't make the correct decision to abandon ship as that is not my or anyone else's place to say!
While I can see where all the construction discussion came from and where it wound up...

Your question is still the most important...the skipper mentioned he thought the boat may have received a fatal blow or two...but after years of repairing and working with fiberglass....sudden failure of composites is not the usual mode...can be...but tough to ascertain in the middle of a storm with the initial damage probably hidden.

Can't fault him for his decision because I don't have even a shred of useful info to do so other than the obvious...tough day at work...could get rescued as the safe decision (probably the smart one)..and he did so.

Lot's to learn??? yes and no. Most things mentioned so far most experienced skippers already know. The biggest learning tool of all is that no matter newbie or experienced...making any errors at sea can be really dangerous...even a rescue...the trick is to reduce those errors to a very few and resolve them before they get the upper hand. Again I'm only stating the obvious....
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Old 11-11-2011, 06:51   #349
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Re: Crew of SV 'Sanctuary' Abandon Ship

I hope we hear from the NARC boats that are still out around Bermuda. It would be interesting to hear their stories and descriptions of their boats and their tactics that have allowed them to survive (so far at least).
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Old 11-11-2011, 07:05   #350
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Re: Crew of SV 'Sanctuary' Abandon Ship

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Originally Posted by goboatingnow View Post
Its a form of elitism really (ogh Jim look, one of those horrible Bendys has got into our yacht club whatever will we do....)

Dave
Nothing wrong with peasants, bagged a few myself over the years


On this Beneteau, I too have no idea whether or not she really was breaking up - the Capt thought she was, and reacted accordingly. Maybe he had read too many Bendy threads over the years

Or maybe he simply understood that they have been designed and built to a spec that is perfectly adequate.
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Old 11-11-2011, 08:12   #351
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Re: Crew of SV 'Sanctuary' Abandon Ship

You may believe a Bendy and an Oyster are built to the same scantlings. I don't.

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Your comments maybe correct or not. Really you need a professional to pass judgement on adhesive etc.

The reality is despite this. These boats are designed and sailed all over Northern European waters. They cross oceans, they survive countless storms. The bulkheads dont detach the deck stays attached. You get the same deck hardware as oysters etc. There's simply no consistent evidence to back up the conclusion you allude to.

On top of that they have to pass the minim um that is CAT A.

What you get in oysters and the like is hours of craftsman ship in teak. What you get in a beneteau is seconds of CNC cut furniture. Both though are strong.

Dave
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Old 11-11-2011, 08:20   #352
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Re: Crew of SV 'Sanctuary' Abandon Ship

The skipper requested help when he feared for the life of his crew. The US Coast Guard retrieved them from their boat. Great job from the Coasties!

The rest of the thread is agenda based opinion to persuade ourselves that if we do this or that it won't happen to us.
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Old 11-11-2011, 08:26   #353
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pirate Re: Crew of SV 'Sanctuary' Abandon Ship

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The skipper requested help when he feared for the life of his crew. The US Coast Guard retrieved them from their boat. Great job from the Coasties!

The rest of the thread is agenda based opinion to persuade ourselves that if we do this or that it won't happen to us.
ROFL.....
Rite on...
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Old 11-11-2011, 08:35   #354
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Re: Crew of SV 'Sanctuary' Abandon Ship

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The skipper requested help when he feared for the life of his crew. The US Coast Guard retrieved them from their boat. Great job from the Coasties!

The rest of the thread is agenda based opinion to persuade ourselves that if we do this or that it won't happen to us.

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Old 11-11-2011, 10:03   #355
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Re: Crew of SV 'Sanctuary' Abandon Ship

I have read almost everything in this thread, I have skipped over some of it and I am wondering if I missed it, but does anyone know what actually happened to the 393 Beneteau in question? Is it still afloat somewhere? Did it actually sink? Did someone recover the boat? Does anyone know the answers?

By the way, I am an inexperienced sailor, I have learned a lot from this thread, I guess I now know that I don't know enough yet.

Thanks to all that have contubuted constuctivly.
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Old 11-11-2011, 10:07   #356
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Re: Crew of SV 'Sanctuary' Abandon Ship

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Originally Posted by John A View Post
The skipper requested help when he feared for the life of his crew. The US Coast Guard retrieved them from their boat. Great job from the Coasties!

The rest of the thread is agenda based opinion to persuade ourselves that if we do this or that it won't happen to us.


Can't believe this thread is still getting "blablas"
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Old 11-11-2011, 10:29   #357
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Re: Crew of SV 'Sanctuary' Abandon Ship

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Originally Posted by psneeld View Post
....
Lot's to learn??? yes and no. Most things mentioned so far most experienced skippers already know. ....
And then there are many of us not so experienced who read threads like this, hoping never to have to utilize any knowledge gained thereby other then avoiding an emergency situation and making a real effort to learn from the experiences of others.

Some things need to be experienced in real life (all the theory in the world about sail trim will never trump doing it, as example), but some things one would rather not.

CF has been a gold mine of knowledge for me.
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Old 11-11-2011, 10:38   #358
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Re: Crew of SV 'Sanctuary' Abandon Ship

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And then there are many of us not so experienced who read threads like this, hoping never to have to utilize any knowledge gained thereby, but making a real effort to learn from the experiences of others.
My hope is that most if not all of the stuff I have read about over the years I NEVER have to put into use.

Was the same way when I was in the Navy on submarine duty as a nuclear plant operator, hoped never to see the casualties we trained about.
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Old 11-11-2011, 11:10   #359
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Re: Crew of SV 'Sanctuary' Abandon Ship

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Originally Posted by John A View Post
The skipper requested help when he feared for the life of his crew. The US Coast Guard retrieved them from their boat. Great job from the Coasties!

The rest of the thread is agenda based opinion to persuade ourselves that if we do this or that it won't happen to us.
The Coast Guard did not retrieve them from their boat. They flew around in circles watching.
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Old 11-11-2011, 12:03   #360
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Re: Crew of SV 'Sanctuary' Abandon Ship

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(...) if conditions are bad enough to be knocked down/rolled when hove to... then they're that much greater running before in those conditions and I'm confident my chances are better warm and dry below than sitting in the cockpit (...)
Clearly, we differ in experiences and opinions. Interestingly, I shared your views up to the point when we got badly knocked down and nearly rolled over. I assigned our mishap to staying hove to long after the conditions deteriorated to the point where this technique is (IMHO) no longer safe for a small craft.

To me, the scenario: "... we went down below, closed all hatches and then IT happened..." is way to common to be counted as an accident. I strongly believe that in a small craft it is dangerous to lay hove to in any developed storm.

Let's hope our respective storm handling tactics will pay back to each of us with many safe returns!

Cheers,
b.
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