Canadian Sailor Murdered in Honduras

[Dave the Canuck]

http://m.theglobeandmail.com/news/na...service=mobile

The latest.

[GordMay]

Greetings and welcome aboard the CF, Adamante.

It’s nice to have another fact checker aboard.

Jim from "Blazing Saddles", recalling his gun fighting career.

Originally Posted by Adamante

I believe I may have seen that movie too: ...

[Adamante]

Originally Posted by GordMay

Greetings and welcome aboard the CF, Adamante.

It’s nice to have another fact checker aboard.

Thanks for the welcome, Gord.

BTW, what's a dazzling urbanite like you doing in a rustic setting like this?

[rebel heart]

Originally Posted by Brob2

Capital punishment certainly has been proven to not to be a deterrent in the USA. I very much doubt it matters any more in countries where poverty and desperation are even more wide spread.

Isn't it great how a thread on the death of a cruiser always devolves into a discussion of weapons on board? Nobody's going to be able to make a post that changes anyone's beliefs on this so we don't stop using threads on tragedies to bolster our arguments? Give it a rest or confine it to the gun control threads.

Full agreement. Tragic that it happened, and pointless to be followed by the arm chair admirals on laptops. Bad stuff happens everywhere.

[SearenitySail]

The story was also posted on Latitude 38 Lectronic Latitude today:

Latitude 38 - 'Lectronic Latitude

Marshall

[scottb]

Heard on the radio report this morning on the way to work, she landed at Toronto Airport and is with family.

and updat from The Toronto Sun

[jjones1349]

I think that all the facts should be known before we judge. Why was the daughter left to defend the ship with a flare gun in a remote anchorage and suceed. This story has many unanswered questions.
Will we ever know considering the remote location and the nature of the relationships in the family?
Will we ever know what happened? Do thugs really go looking in desolate anchorages? I hope the crime sceen is recovered and scrutinzed. This just sounds weird.

[LakeSuperior]

Originally Posted by Hud3

Brob2,

Thanks for stating the obvious, which for some reason some folks don't get. Let me repeat your very appropriate words...

If off-topic posts such as the more recent ones continue, one or more of three things will happen: the posts will be deleted without PM to the poster, repeated posting of such will attract an Official Warning or Strike, and/or the thread will be shut down.

Please show some respect and consideration for the vast majority of members who consider voicing your strongly-held opinions about guns, violence, self-defense, etc. in a thread about a tragic incident involving a cruising sailor exceedingly offensive.

Most sailors are natural problem solvers. An important part of the problem solving process is learning from someone else's mistakes and misfortunes. For example, there is usually lively discussion in the threads after the sinking of someones yacht centering around what they may or may not have done wrong and how to prevent the same thing from happening in the future. Other examples include ad nauseum discussions about anchoring, dragging, better anchors to prevent dragging, and how to attach anchors to chain and rode. Which, IMO are discussions that are the essence of CF.

I wonder then how discussion motivated by a brutal criminal act toward what could be done to prevent it in the future to members of our own community are any different than what kind of drogue to use to prevent a roll-over? Admittedly, sometime the tactlessness is raw but in general most sailors are just trying to solve the problem. Like it or not weapons are one solution.

[speakeasy]

Originally Posted by LakeSuperior

Most sailors are natural problem solvers. An important part of the problem solving process is learning from someone else's mistakes and misfortunes. For example, there is usually lively discussion in the threads after the sinking of someones yacht centering around what they may or may not have done wrong and how to prevent the same thing from happening in the future. Other examples include ad nauseum discussions about anchoring, dragging, better anchors to prevent dragging, and how to attach anchors to chain and rode. Which, IMO are discussions that are the essence of CF.

I wonder then how discussion motivated by a brutal criminal act toward what could be done to prevent it in the future to members of our own community are any different than what kind of drogue to use to prevent a roll-over? Admittedly, sometime the tactlessness is raw but in general most sailors are just trying to solve the problem. Like it or not weapons are one solution.

Yes and no. If you really intend cruising to other countries, odds are high you will draw heat from the authorities if not jail time carrying weapons.

Just a thought. Sitting up in the cockpit in a tranquil marina de La Paz, thinking about finishing my new owner’s discovered To-Do list and getting under way out to anchorages and beyond, it occurs to me that this attack on a cruiser abroad in a very isolated anchorage, is really only news to be used for people already living at anchor abroad or immanently about to. It isn’t news for sailboat owners per se.

[GordMay]

Some new details:

Honduran officials recovered his bullet-ridden body from his sailboat, which lay capsized off the Honduran coast.

After they had anchored there, the Egrmajers were set upon by four men about 6 p.m. Thursday.

She was able to escape injury by hiding inside the boat, but the pirates shot Milan Egrmajer four times, and looted the vessel of food, electronics and money

Myda then managed to frighten the pirates off by firing a flare gun

Read more ➥ Daughter returns after Honduran pirate ordeal

[Dave the Canuck]

What I'm having a hard time with is how she remained hidden on a 35 ft. boat while it was being ransacked. We're obviously not getting the whole story.

[Hud3]

Originally Posted by LakeSuperior

Most sailors are natural problem solvers. An important part of the problem solving process is learning from someone else's mistakes and misfortunes. For example, there is usually lively discussion in the threads after the sinking of someones yacht centering around what they may or may not have done wrong and how to prevent the same thing from happening in the future. Other examples include ad nauseum discussions about anchoring, dragging, better anchors to prevent dragging, and how to attach anchors to chain and rode. Which, IMO are discussions that are the essence of CF.

I wonder then how discussion motivated by a brutal criminal act toward what could be done to prevent it in the future to members of our own community are any different than what kind of drogue to use to prevent a roll-over? Admittedly, sometime the tactlessness is raw but in general most sailors are just trying to solve the problem. Like it or not weapons are one solution.

Admittedly, it's a fine line between "discussion motivated by a brutal criminal act toward what could be done to prevent it in the future to members of our own community", versus pontificating and endlessly debating strongly held philosophical beliefs that aren't going to change no matter what anyone says. The former is OK; the latter almost always leads to rancorous arguments that get the thread locked. We allow a lot of latitude for thread drift in discussions, but when the drift is toward topics that typically create acrimony based on past experience, we tend to step in with a warning.

It appeared clear to me that this thread was in danger of heading off into the "pontification mode", so that's why I posted. BTW, if anyone feels like they're being restricted from discussing something important, he always has the option of starting a new thread, as long as it's related to the core topics of this forum--cruising and boating in general.

[Vasco]

It will be interesting if we ever get the facts. Every published report so far has given a different story, some varying greatly. The only facts so far is that the daughter has been rescued and the father, unfortunately, has been killed and this took place in Honduras waters.

[David_Old_Jersey]

Originally Posted by Hud3

BTW, if anyone feels like they're being restricted from discussing something important, he always has the option of starting a new thread, as long as it's related to the core topics of this forum--cruising and boating in general.

http://www.cruisersforum.com/forums/...als-51075.html

[Panamajames]

Belize News - Belize Leading Newspaper | Breaking News - Amandala Online

My wife and I were traveling in July and due to large waves we stopped where this Captain was murdered. We entered the lagoon at El Diamantes Honduras in the middle and noticed the depth was about 5.5 ft. I have a 5 ft draft. I noticed a little fishing village with one boat on the shore. Due to both we decided to move out of the lagoon and around the corner in the big bay (unprotected from the west) and waited the weather for 4-5 days. We had a bad feeling (maybe a lonely feeling) about the place. Every day a couple of water taxis went by and so everyone knew we were there. It is a beautiful place but very lonely. Anyway we had a plan to fight off the bad guys. Besides the flare gun, spear gun we had 2 big cans of BEAR SPRAY that shoots (with no wind or down wind over 15 ft.) That was our plan if anyone got close. As most of you know I was shot in Panama 6 times in my car. I had a plan then as I had a gun below my seat but the shooters were very very fast. So point is, you can be prepared and ready to defend yourself without hesitation. Negotiating can work but the back up needs to be readily available. In my opinion Honduras is one of the most dangerous countries in the world. But there is danger everywhere and you have to have a plan. I feel real bad for this family, real bad and for cruisers everywhere that encounter the bad guys. It is getting worse. The poor get poorer etc. We are heading for Honduras in Feb. We changed our travel plans from December to Feb to avoid the holidays when theft is at its maximum. In central America the highest theft is near Christmas. I wonder why, but its true. I have lived in Panama for 5 years.
I am ready for the bad guys either in my home or on the boat. They wont know what hit em because I am still a little angry about being shot before. Merry Christmas and Good Sailing everyone.