Boating Under The Influence??

[timbenner]

I wonder if being on a City Mooring Ball, BUI, is the same as being tied to a dock??

My conclusion, after reading all of this, is that you could get a BUI while at anchor and it would probably stick in Court. If you had a sober person on board, and told the officer that they were the designated "anchor watcher", you might get off.

Of course keeping a low profile, not pissing off the officer, keeping your mouth shut all work to your advantage. I see more and more examples of officers blatantly giving out citations that are out of line and won't stick, but do it anyway to meet a quota.

Example:

A friend of mine was loading his small fishing boat on a trailer at a boat ramp. Florida Marine Patrol officer (age mid 20's) goes into my friends Suburban truck and pulls out a shot gun. Starts loading the shot gun to find out whether it holds 3 or 5 shells. Finds out it holds 5 and gives him a $250 ticket for hunting without the 3 shell plug in the gun. He wasn't hunting, he was fishing. Goes to Court and the Judge throws out the ticket, but friend has to pay $250 in Court Costs. The officer was out to fund the Court budget.

[Southern Star]

Tackoff, I would be careful and at least get some legal advice before giving it. I suspect that you may find that the provision to which you refer is in the Liquor License Act of Ontario, a provincial statute which may govern the locations where alcohol can be legally consumed - in this case, a 'residence'.

You may also find that it is the Criminal Code of Canada - a federal statute, that governs the criminal offence of impaired care or control of a vessel. Indeed you may even be advised that depending upon the circumstances, you could still be convicted of care or control of your vessel while your ability is impaired, even when under anchor.

Again people, apart from general discussions, be careful. The laws in this area are complex and this is decidedly not the place to be seeking legal advice. No disrespect intended to anyone - but remember, ignorance of the law is not a defence!

Brad

[READY2GO]

I have a family of cops, brother, nephew, uncles. My experience, if you ask a cop if they have the athourity to do something? Their answer is always yes. Regardless of the truth.

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by READY2GO

I have a family of cops, brother, nephew, uncles. My experience, if you ask a cop if they have the athourity to do something? Their answer is always yes. Regardless of the truth.

ROFL.... sounds about right

[smurphny]

Let's face it. We live in a police state. There are almost more "law enforcement" boats on the water than sailors. Environmental police, harbor patrols, local police, county police, state police, Coast Guard, harbormasters, homeland security, surveillance, security zones...there's no end to it in sight. Police, like all other government agencies NEVER get smaller. They need to continually find law abiding boaters to harass with ever more bizarre rules, thought up by local political cohorts, to justify their jobs and expand their payrolls with our tax dollars. The sad thing is that my generation, who are old enough to remember what freedom on the water was, when there was space to throw the hook in places not jammed with unused municipal moorings, and police boats, and when personal responsibility was the rule, are disappearing.

[boatman61]

Originally Posted by smurphny

Let's face it. We live in a police state. There are almost more "law enforcement" boats on the water than sailors. Environmental police, harbor patrols, local police, county police, state police, Coast Guard, harbormasters, homeland security, surveillance, security zones...there's no end to it in sight. Police, like all other government agencies NEVER get smaller. They need to continually find law abiding boaters to harass with ever more bizarre rules, thought up by local political cohorts, to justify their jobs and expand their payrolls with our tax dollars. The sad thing is that my generation, who are old enough to remember what freedom on the water was, when there was space to throw the hook in places not jammed with unused municipal moorings, and police boats, and when personal responsibility was the rule, are disappearing.

Is that surely not the fault of the 'new generation boaters' in the last 20 odd years...
I've noticed that in spite of repeated calls from 'the people' for less governmental control the minute the slightest thing goes wrong they start blaming the authorities and screaming something should be done by them..
The problem is they want the 'freedom' without being 'Responsible'....
You live in your own Creation...

[psneeld]

Originally Posted by smurphny

Let's face it. We live in a police state. There are almost more "law enforcement" boats on the water than sailors. Environmental police, harbor patrols, local police, county police, state police, Coast Guard, harbormasters, homeland security, surveillance, security zones...there's no end to it in sight. Police, like all other government agencies NEVER get smaller. They need to continually find law abiding boaters to harass with ever more bizarre rules, thought up by local political cohorts, to justify their jobs and expand their payrolls with our tax dollars. The sad thing is that my generation, who are old enough to remember what freedom on the water was, when there was space to throw the hook in places not jammed with unused municipal moorings, and police boats, and when personal responsibility was the rule, are disappearing.

I don't know where you are from...but in NJ...the marine police are not known for writing huge amounts of citations despite an active presence on high volume weekends...and not as much the rest of the time.

Check the news lately...with governments nearly banckrupt...around here police/fire are being downsized a lot lately...

[psneeld]

Originally Posted by boatman61

Is that surely not the fault of the 'new generation boaters' in the last 20 odd years...
I've noticed that in spite of repeated calls from 'the people' for less governmental control the minute the slightest thing goes wrong they start blaming the authorities and screaming something should be done by them..
The problem is they want the 'freedom' without being 'Responsible'....
You live in your own Creation...

bingo!

[smurphny]

The younger generation just doesn't know what it is like to have freedom from intrusive government. They have been brought up in the "nanny" state, being told that they are all just wonderful and that government will solve all their problems and protect everyone from everything. It's all part of the disastrous condition of American culture. This is quite a bit off boating topics so, will just say freedom on the water is an important issue to think about.

[rebel heart]

Originally Posted by markpierce

So, what about moored boats? They are anchored too. Me thinks you're making a "stretch."

Nope. Moored is "made fast to the ground", as in a mooring, pier, dock, etc. That's why there is specifically an "anchor watch" specified, but not a "dock watch" or "mooring watch".

The intent of the anchor watch is (and accurately so) because vessels slip anchor frequently enough, and often the anchoring is occurring in areas where other vessels transit for the sake of anchoring.

And in regards to it being "new mariners", you'll note that the official name is COLREGS 72. You guessed it, that's 1972. I'm not a COLREGS historian but I don't believe any of the laws we're talking about here have been changed sinced the original stuff 39 years ago.

[doug86]

Originally Posted by Sailmonkey

So if you drag, and turn on a red over red light.......does this not make you the non operator of the vessel

No. "Not Under Command" does not mean that the vessel has no operator; it means that the vessel is mechanically incapable of getting out of the way of other vessels, usually due to steering or propulsion failure. A vessel NUC is still required to have a competent crew; otherwise, who turned on the red lights?

Red over Red doesn't mean "no one in charge", it means the guy in charge can't fully comply with the COLREGs. It is like "restricted in ability to maneuver", except that instead of 'restricted', the vessel has no ability to maneuver.

[John A]

Colregs are not always legal and binding for boaters!

Look at a paper chart(gasp), just to the West of the Golden Gate Bridge is a line drawen acrossed the entrance to the Gate labeled "Colreg demarkation line". East of that line local law prevails. I'm sure that this is the case in other locals.

[skipmac]

Originally Posted by smurphny

Let's face it. We live in a police state. There are almost more "law enforcement" boats on the water than sailors.

Not sure where you do your boating but in south Florida you go out on a nice day on the weekend the ratio of private boaters to LE (yes that includes USCG, marine patrol, local sheriff, customs, DEA, and any other group) is more like a few hundred to one.

Last year did the ICW from LI Sound to FL and saw LE a total of four times. Two of those were homeland security patrols (one at the UN when Obama was giving a speech, the other at Norfolk guarding a nuclear sub leaving port) that had no interest in recreational boaters other than keeping them out of the security zone.

[doug86]

Originally Posted by John A

Colregs are not always legal and binding for boaters!

Look at a paper chart(gasp), just to the West of the Golden Gate Bridge is a line drawen acrossed the entrance to the Gate labeled "Colreg demarkation line". East of that line local law prevails. I'm sure that this is the case in other locals.

"Local Laws"? If you compare the Inland Rules (the ones in effect inside the demarcation line) with the COLREGs, you find, with few exceptions, that they are almost identical. Almost all the coastal states of the USA have also adopted the Inland Rules as a part of their state law.

[John A]

When I arrived at the entrance to Lake Worth singlehaded from Westend, with a hole in the side of my hull, the forestay ripped off, torn sails on the foredeck, and the bowsprit, stancions and safety lines is disarray, I was met by the Harbor Patrol. They didn't care one wit about my circumstances, and boarded my boat for a drug search. Not finding any, they departed to let me fend for myself.
That was my welcome back to the USA.