Cruisers Forum
 


Join CruisersForum Today

Reply
 
Thread Tools Rate Thread Display Modes
Old 16-01-2014, 18:27   #196
Registered User

Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: australia
Posts: 94
re: Alpha 42 "Be Good Too" rescue 300 miles off Cape Henry Merged

That bit about doing 8 knots into a deep ocean wave and then going backwards really worries me...that would have to be a genuine top to bottom breaking rogue wave that was way bigger (read way bigger than just your average 20 footer) than average conditions. I've done a lot of heavy weather sailing into and out of New Zealand in cats including one really nasty trip a couple of years ago where a monohull was lost near us about 200 miles to the east of NZ due to a rogue wave. I just can't imagine doing 8 knots in a well found cat one minute and going backwards the next just out of the blue. I've never been on a cat that felt for even a second like it was going to do that, the bigger and steeper the waves, the more air the boat got getting over them (hehe). Not saying it didn't happen (I believe it did), just sounds very strange and in my mind can only be explained by something in the design, which if it is, will be verified in time as it would be sure to happen again.
Re being taken off, they sound like they've been at this sailing gig for long enough to know when its time to leave. I would have thought about trying to ditch the rudders, sounds like they were not super strong (the underside pics of the boat show then very far aft where there could not be much meat or length for the stock tubes) even if that entailed bashing them and the glass structure out with a hammer / chisel and/or ripping them out from underneath with a winch, rather take a couple of holes in the stern scoops which can be repaired than lose the whole boat.
The wine bit is a bit much, that should have stayed private, they will cop some flack for that....there is also that annoying insurance small print about masters/crew employing "all reasonable efforts to save their vessel"....
__________________

__________________
Doe818 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-01-2014, 18:34   #197
Registered User

Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: australia
Posts: 94
re: Alpha 42 "Be Good Too" rescue 300 miles off Cape Henry Merged

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cotemar View Post
Alpha 42 "Be Good Too"

6 Going south against winter northerlies

[/FONT]

Huh????? going south against northerlies????
__________________

__________________
Doe818 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-01-2014, 18:42   #198
Registered User
 
Cotemar's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2007
Boat: FP, Helia 44 Evo
Posts: 5,717
re: Alpha 42 "Be Good Too" rescue 300 miles off Cape Henry Merged

Quote:
Originally Posted by Doe818 View Post
Huh????? going south against northerlies????
The prevailing winter wind and waves are going north and they are sailing head on into them as they are going south to the BVI’s
__________________
Cotemar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-01-2014, 18:43   #199
Elvish meaning 'Far-Wanderer'
 
Palarran's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Me - Michigan / Boat - Tenerife
Boat: 56' Fountaine Pajot Marquises
Posts: 2,641
re: Alpha 42 "Be Good Too" rescue 300 miles off Cape Henry Merged

Quote:
Originally Posted by Doe818 View Post
Huh????? going south against northerlies????
OOPS
__________________
Not all who wander are lost

http://www.sailblogs.com/member/palarran/
Palarran is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-01-2014, 18:46   #200
Registered User
 
Sand crab's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Gig Harbor, WA
Boat: 34' Crowther tri sold 16' Kayak now
Posts: 3,157
re: Alpha 42 "Be Good Too" rescue 300 miles off Cape Henry Merged

Quote:
Originally Posted by colemj View Post
Just the part about the wave - the rest of the spin about the rudders, etc is him.
Mark
Top of the page.

Capt. Hank Schmitt after his rescue:“…no other yacht would have survived this rudder damage after the rogue wave hit and drove us vioently backward…”
__________________
We don't need no stinking badges.
Sand crab is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-01-2014, 18:49   #201
Registered User

Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: australia
Posts: 94
re: Alpha 42 "Be Good Too" rescue 300 miles off Cape Henry Merged

Quote:
Originally Posted by Cotemar View Post
The prevailing winter wind and waves are going north and they are sailing head on into them as they are going south to the BVI’s
I know which way the BVI's are mate....I also know what a northerly is...no need to go bold and red on me...
__________________
Doe818 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-01-2014, 18:54   #202
Registered User
 
sparau's Avatar

Join Date: Mar 2012
Location: sunshine coast, aus
Boat: laser 2
Posts: 300
re: Alpha 42 "Be Good Too" rescue 300 miles off Cape Henry Merged

Quote:
At one point the boat experienced 50 knot winds and 20 foot seas but the wave piercing bows worked great
Up until the point where it buried the bows and caught the wave on the bridge deck?
__________________
laser 2 with a 470 main = tippy little boat
sparau is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-01-2014, 18:55   #203
Registered User
 
Cotemar's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2007
Boat: FP, Helia 44 Evo
Posts: 5,717
re: Alpha 42 "Be Good Too" rescue 300 miles off Cape Henry Merged

Quote:
Originally Posted by Doe818 View Post
I know which way the BVI's are mate....I also know what a northerly is...no need to go bold and red on me...
Sorry, I thought you did not know what I meant, when I seen all your ????

(Huh????? going south against northerlies????)
__________________
Cotemar is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-01-2014, 18:58   #204
Elvish meaning 'Far-Wanderer'
 
Palarran's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Me - Michigan / Boat - Tenerife
Boat: 56' Fountaine Pajot Marquises
Posts: 2,641
re: Alpha 42 "Be Good Too" rescue 300 miles off Cape Henry Merged

Quote:
Originally Posted by Doe818 View Post
That bit about doing 8 knots into a deep ocean wave and then going backwards really worries me...that would have to be a genuine top to bottom breaking rogue wave that was way bigger (read way bigger than just your average 20 footer) than average conditions. I've done a lot of heavy weather sailing into and out of New Zealand in cats including one really nasty trip a couple of years ago where a monohull was lost near us about 200 miles to the east of NZ due to a rogue wave. I just can't imagine doing 8 knots in a well found cat one minute and going backwards the next just out of the blue. I've never been on a cat that felt for even a second like it was going to do that, the bigger and steeper the waves, the more air the boat got getting over them (hehe). Not saying it didn't happen (I believe it did), just sounds very strange and in my mind can only be explained by something in the design, which if it is, will be verified in time as it would be sure to happen again.
Re being taken off, they sound like they've been at this sailing gig for long enough to know when its time to leave. I would have thought about trying to ditch the rudders, sounds like they were not super strong (the underside pics of the boat show then very far aft where there could not be much meat or length for the stock tubes) even if that entailed bashing them and the glass structure out with a hammer / chisel and/or ripping them out from underneath with a winch, rather take a couple of holes in the stern scoops which can be repaired than lose the whole boat.
The wine bit is a bit much, that should have stayed private, they will cop some flack for that....there is also that annoying insurance small print about masters/crew employing "all reasonable efforts to save their vessel"....
Great post. It's interesting to read the latest accounts. I don't think the motors where down. So why they had to bail by hand is a question. It also sounds like only one rudder was causing the steering problem to port so if you had to do massive demo to remove it only one stern compartment would have been compromised.

Is this area normally associated with true rogue waves?
__________________
Not all who wander are lost

http://www.sailblogs.com/member/palarran/
Palarran is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-01-2014, 19:03   #205
Registered User
 
Sand crab's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Gig Harbor, WA
Boat: 34' Crowther tri sold 16' Kayak now
Posts: 3,157
re: Alpha 42 "Be Good Too" rescue 300 miles off Cape Henry Merged

Quote:
Originally Posted by Palarran View Post
Is this area normally associated with true rogue waves?
There's been more than a few there. That gulf stream probably has something to do with it.

List of rogue waves - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
__________________
We don't need no stinking badges.
Sand crab is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-01-2014, 19:08   #206
Sponsoring Vendor
 
Neptune's Gear's Avatar

Community Sponsor

Join Date: Oct 2012
Location: Gulf Harbour, New Zealand
Boat: Farr Phase 4, 12.8m
Posts: 992
re: Alpha 42 "Be Good Too" rescue 300 miles off Cape Henry Merged

Interesting, I've read the whole thread. Plenty of conflicting stories already. No motors, but one motor full ahead etc. The only guys who really know are those who were on board, and more so whoever was on watch at the time.
IF she was forced bodily astern, hard enough to break the steering, it is easy to imagine that the motors could have had a hydraulic lock due to water ingress in the presumably aft facing exhausts.
Plenty of comments by the armchair admirals. All I think is that there but for the grace of God go I.
It will be interesting to see if an accurate sequence of events does come out.
Oh, and I agree, 8ft seas and 35 knots is not a real test of an Ocean capable vessel.
Pleased everyone is safe!
__________________
Matt Paulin
Neptunes Gear Ltd
www.neptunes-gear.com
Neptune's Gear is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-01-2014, 19:08   #207
Registered User

Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: Boston, MA
Boat: Beneteau Oceanis 43 & S2 6.9
Posts: 963
re: Alpha 42 "Be Good Too" rescue 300 miles off Cape Henry Merged

"At one point the boat experienced 50 knot winds and 20 foot seas but the wave piercing bows worked great."

So the definition of a rogue wave is one that is substantially larger than the typical waves. So if these were the sea conditions, how much larger was this wave to be called a rogue wave? Would it have to be 30'? 40'?

With conditions such as these, shouldn't someone be at the helm (it noted autopilot was on, but not whether or not someone was actively under control). I understand the weather wasn't great, but if you were paying attention, might you not get some warning of the wave? How was the visibility? If the rogue wave was as big as 30-40' isn't it likely it would have taken out the genoa, main sail or knocked the dinghy from the davits?

And shouldn't a blue water boat be able to handle these kind of conditions, rogue wave aside (if it really was a rogue wave)?

Just wondering if the story matches the pictures?
__________________
maytrix is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-01-2014, 19:27   #208
Registered User
 
Sand crab's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2010
Location: Gig Harbor, WA
Boat: 34' Crowther tri sold 16' Kayak now
Posts: 3,157
re: Alpha 42 "Be Good Too" rescue 300 miles off Cape Henry Merged

Quote:
Originally Posted by maytrix View Post
control). I understand the weather wasn't great, but if you were paying attention, might you not get some warning of the wave?
The problem with rogues is that they pop up out of nowhere and disappear just as fast.
__________________
We don't need no stinking badges.
Sand crab is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-01-2014, 19:49   #209
Senior Cruiser
 
colemj's Avatar

Cruisers Forum Supporter

Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Presently on US East Coast
Boat: Manta 40 "Reach"
Posts: 10,049
Images: 12
re: Alpha 42 "Be Good Too" rescue 300 miles off Cape Henry Merged

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sand crab View Post
Top of the page.

Capt. Hank Schmitt after his rescue:“…no other yacht would have survived this rudder damage after the rogue wave hit and drove us vioently backward…”
Yes, I said the part about the wave is attributed to the captain. The part about the "massive" rudders and other stuff is Tarjan. And I think Tarjan put those words in the captains mouth. But that is a personal opinion for which I never expect to have any evidence.

Mark
__________________
www.svreach.com

You do not need a parachute to skydive. You only need a parachute to skydive twice.
colemj is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 16-01-2014, 20:25   #210
Registered User

Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: WY / Currently in Hayes VA on the Chesapeake
Boat: Ocean Alexander, Ocean 44
Posts: 922
re: Alpha 42 "Be Good Too" rescue 300 miles off Cape Henry Merged

Quote:
Originally Posted by Southern Star View Post
As do I Rockdawg, as do I. If they are insured, it will be interesting to see if they purchase another Alpha 42.
Yep! That will tell the tale.
__________________

__________________
darylat8750 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
Aeroyacht Alpha 42, Alpha 42, Gregor Tarjan, offshore, rescue, yacht

Thread Tools
Display Modes Rate This Thread
Rate This Thread:

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off




Copyright 2002- Social Knowledge, LLC All Rights Reserved.

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 05:14.


Google+
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Social Knowledge Networks
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 1
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.

ShowCase vBulletin Plugins by Drive Thru Online, Inc.