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Old 10-06-2010, 18:19   #1
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Abby Sunderland - The Debate

I certainly hope she is safely rescued but I do not agree with sending children out to sea alone. Its a bad precedent to send younger and younger children out to sea in order to set a record of some sort.

They are children for gawds sake...not lab rats to run tests on to see at what age the first one dies.

For those who support this type of activity, face it, the younger they are, the greater the chance of death. Why on Earth would someone support sending younger and younger children out to sea? At what age does this end? Only when someone dies will this sort of record breaking stupidity stop.

Sorry, but I am pretty passionate about endangering children like this. Its pretty easy to predict that this will stop only after a child has lost their life.
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Old 10-06-2010, 18:24   #2
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Let's stir up a hornet's nest - this was inevitable - a kid in the Southern Ocean in June???? And JW was bloody lucky not to die on her first night out. It was only a matter of time till one of these juniors got into serious trouble.
I too hope she's OK but don't hold your breath.
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Old 10-06-2010, 19:16   #3
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Regardless of outcome this is going to make it harder for the recreational cruiser. This will start up the push for more regulations, making people pay for rescue, who pays etc. This will not worry the people behind JW as they continue to count the money they have made but for you and I it will higher insurance premiums etc etc
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Old 10-06-2010, 19:23   #4
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Regardless of outcome this is going to make it harder for the recreational cruiser. This will start up the push for more regulations, making people pay for rescue, who pays etc. This will not worry the people behind JW as they continue to count the money they have made but for you and I it will higher insurance premiums etc etc
Come on, this has been happening as long as there have been round the world racing.

Nothing new. Move along.
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Old 10-06-2010, 20:03   #5
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Lets keep the recent Abby Sunderland news all in one thread please.
Nice idea, but how do we little people accomplish that?

Otherwise, I hope for the best, and for Abby, who has had great spirit in all regards.

Other, otherwise - it was foolish choice of boats from the beginning.

That to me is a far greater criticism than that her parents or anyone else supported her going. It is very dangerous for 16 year olds to play American high school football, and to drive on freeways, and to play beer pong, and many other things. Not to mention 18 year olds going to war for the country. But we do not call any of it child endangerment. Please.
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Old 10-06-2010, 20:04   #6
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This is what I want: I want Abby to be found, and rescued without injury. Following her safe return, I want every cent of her rescue charged to her parents. Then, possible criminal charges for buying their daughter a 40 foot race boat and turning her loose in the Southern Ocean in June. When I think of what could be happening to that girl right now, it pisses me off.
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Old 10-06-2010, 20:11   #7
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Who is for letting younger and younger children sail off on their own until one dies? That's the path we are going down.

That's much different than letting a 16 year old play football. That's more like letting a, 15 14, 13, 12 , 11, 10, 9 year old etc play football with 16 year olds. At what point does it go from letting them take reasonable chances to child endangerment? At some point it clearly does reach child endangerment..like putting a 7 year old on the field with 16 year olds. Does the age of endangerment get defined at the age the first one dies? Or can we come to our senses and stop the madness before one has to die?

Why in our society must tragedy first strike before common sense is enacted?
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Old 10-06-2010, 20:24   #8
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That's much different than letting a 16 year old play football?
Nothing to say except - Whatever. If you don't think high school football is a dangerous sport, then have it your way. Not worth the time to discuss and argue for me. to each his own, and I believe high school football to be quite dangerous, but I do not oppose it.

I think it is just as controversial to risk a brilliant 40 year old life by sitting such a person on top of a Saturn booster rocket, as it is to let a 16 year old drive a race car. Both happen. In fact, the more experienced and knowledgeable person on the rocket might be the greater loss risk.

Basically, I am really sick of whining crowds wanting to eliminate any manner of risk from life. Thank goodness that spirit didn't surface early on in the evolution of mankind and society.

The more I think about this the more I realize what some folks would say: "Let's only risk the lives of really old people." You know, maybe there is something to that. Too funny. And a bit absurd.



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Old 10-06-2010, 20:32   #9
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It's not at all absurd when you stop to think that children rarely know what's best for them. As adults, we are responsible for ourselves. This is not so with children where its the parents job to raise them until they have the wisdom to know what is best for themselves.

Using the same line of reasoning, we should let babies put paper clips in electrical outlets because they should be allowed to take risks. We had parents at one time to keep us from doing stupid risky things. When the parents become the ones who encourage the risk, then why have parents at all?

I am not risk averse for myself or my child. I am averse to taking on ridiculous risk that accomplishes nothing....or assuming high risk for something as useless as fame.
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Old 10-06-2010, 20:32   #10
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I think it is just as controversial to risk a brilliant 40 year old life by sitting such a person on top of a Saturn booster rocket, as it is to let a 16 year old drive a race car. Both happen. In fact, the more experienced and knowledgeable person on the rocket might be the greater loss risk.
Did ya ever stop to think that maybe there was a greater rate of return in the risking of a brilliant (also extremely well trained adult, professional pilot) 40 year old astronaut aimed at the moon, then a 16 year old teenager aimed at a record? I thought not...
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Old 10-06-2010, 20:52   #11
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Did ya ever stop to think that maybe there was a greater rate of return in the risking of a brilliant (also extremely well trained adult, professional pilot) 40 year old astronaut aimed at the moon, then a 16 year old teenager aimed at a record? I thought not...
Wrong, Assumption Breath!
I spent too much of my life thinking about, and advising on, risk/reward profiles. I wish I didn't always think about "that". Apparently you don't think there was much at risk in a space shot. I think there was.

My only point in any of this is the tendency I see to criticize, and then suggesting there "ought to be a law" when this sort of discussion breaks out. That's all. We don't agree on this. Thats all to that, as well.

I recognize that you have a valid reason for your view. Do you offer me the same open-mindedness? (I won't assume the answer.)

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Old 10-06-2010, 20:57   #12
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Immediately after she activated the second EPIRB she was abducted by aliens.

And that is no more an unreasonable supposition than any of you have made.

Perhaps we should just cross our fingers, hope for the best, perhaps a little prayer from the believers, and wait and see. Couldn't hurt.
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Old 10-06-2010, 21:01   #13
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Absolutely Jim. I also didn't mention anything about laws. I'm not in favor either. We agree on that too. I also like the term "Assumption breath"! What I'm not in favor of is buying your 16 year old a 40' race boat, aiming her at the Southern Ocean in June, and praying others will come to her rescue when the feces hits the fan. She is in my thoughts tonight, and I will worry until I hear she is OK. After that, if the parents can afford the "team", they can afford the rescue...
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Old 10-06-2010, 21:06   #14
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Absolutely Jim. I also didn't mention anything about laws. I'm not in favor either. We agree on that too. I also like the term "Assumption breath"! What I'm not in favor of is buying your 16 year old a 40' race boat, aiming her at the Southern Ocean in June, and praying others will come to her rescue when the feces hits the fan. She is in my thoughts tonight, and I will worry until I hear she is OK. After that, if the parents can afford the "team", they can afford the rescue...
Well then, now we are completely aligned!

Yes, I am sick to my stomach thinking about this, and need to go get lost in some rotten action movie.

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Old 10-06-2010, 21:08   #15
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It's not at all absurd when you stop to think that children rarely know what's best for them. As adults, we are responsible for ourselves. This is not so with children where its the parents job to raise them until they have the wisdom to know what is best for themselves.

Using the same line of reasoning, we should let babies put paper clips in electrical outlets because they should be allowed to take risks. We had parents at one time to keep us from doing stupid risky things. When the parents become the ones who encourage the risk, then why have parents at all?

I am not risk averse for myself or my child. I am averse to taking on ridiculous risk that accomplishes nothing....or assuming high risk for something as useless as fame.
VERY well said!
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