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Old 24-05-2014, 16:29   #91
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Re: 85-Foot Motor Yacht Sinks at Launch

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Originally Posted by socaldmax View Post
When you say it will not remain stable, I'm assuming that's because it requires a great deal of ballast that hasn't been installed yet?

I wonder why they would launch the boat if it didn't have enough ballast to even sit upright on it's own?
From those present, the Coast Guard had stability tests conducted with it in it's present state. When the sling was eased it immediately started to tilt. So the sling arrangement and the transport plan had to be approved.

Why? Didn't know? Felt it would be ok? Some compelling reason they had to launch then such as perhaps a progress payment due on launch and it was needed to stay open? Felt it would remain stable enough they could then work with adding or arranging ballast? Desperation sometimes leads to inappropriate risk taking? Even the limited ballast installed wasn't done properly?

Also had it been floated in a sling, as is most often done at larger yards, they could have been sure before releasing it. A crane instead of dollies.

I don't know the answer to that question of why. However, I'll state one thing from years of experience. Companies in financial trouble take shortcuts and chances. (Individuals do the same). It's just human nature. When it's a clothing manufacturer shipping goods that are sub par it's hardly newsworthy and it happens all the time. When it's a pet treats manufacturer in China, shipping tainted treats, dogs and cats die. Unfortunately that's happened often. In this case we clearly don't have all the facts, but the one thing we know without question is that a serious mistake was made, either accidentally or knowledgeably aware of the risk. Was it the dollies, the boat, the ramp, all the above? We don't yet know. Were their warnings? Well, you look at the photos and video. Look at them stopping and then deciding to resume. May have been many warnings before that point. But even then, wouldn't a prudent decision have been to check everything and, if necessary, delay launching?

They took the chance any issue could be fixed. Well, the crew tried to fix it and one member nearly lost their life. See this tragedy was minor compared to what it nearly was.
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Old 24-05-2014, 19:52   #92
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Re: 85-Foot Motor Yacht Sinks at Launch

This floating stability check just confirms my first post #26 and that she has neutral or slightly negative metacentric height. (Loll)

No positive stability at launch and a ridiculously risky launch method.

The Fore and Aft dollies looked very inadequate.
No vertical supports (Posts) to rub rails to steady and hold boat upright while keel comes off the blocks by slow immersion into deeper water.

(On First Launch you have no firm idea of fore and aft trim so you anticipate it will pivot off either the bow or stern...which makes it very tender even on a ballasted boat)

Monitoring the pressure on vertical posts also you to measure the extent of list and gives you the chance to cancel launch if natural list appears to be extreme.

Instead they launched it like a 20ft speed boat with men in the engine room.

Could have been tragic instead of just plain stupid!
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Old 24-05-2014, 20:11   #93
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Re: 85-Foot Motor Yacht Sinks at Launch

I have a hard time looking at the proportions and imagining how the machinery can be low enough in this shallow draft vessel to make the center of mass be below the center of buoyancy. I wonder if the permanent ballast was even installed.
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Old 24-05-2014, 20:28   #94
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Re: 85-Foot Motor Yacht Sinks at Launch

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I wonder if the permanent ballast was even installed.
Normally the Yard would not install the permanent ballast on a custom build until floating and tested.

If launched by crane it is kept in sling and water tanks completely filled to compensate for no ballast. Then released and assessed with a known load factor for safe stability when empty.

Not unusual for 3 or 4 loadings of Ballast in different void spaces to trim and give a safe GM.

Sometimes a compromise is made and a notation that vessel can never be LESS than 20-30% loaded.
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Old 24-05-2014, 21:53   #95
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Re: 85-Foot Motor Yacht Sinks at Launch

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NYC - 80's - early 90's
Back when Loisida was still spicy.
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Old 24-05-2014, 21:58   #96
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Re: 85-Foot Motor Yacht Sinks at Launch

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Back when Loisida was still spicy.
Yeah, before there was StarF**Ks everywhere and they turned the town into Disneyland.
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Old 24-05-2014, 22:15   #97
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Re: 85-Foot Motor Yacht Sinks at Launch

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Yeah, before there was StarF**Ks everywhere and they turned the town into Disneyland.
You probably remember Downtown Beirut, Save The Robots & The Palladium.

Those were interesting days in that area. It's all just a memory now. Once Hilly Kristal caved in, even the mighty CB's folded.
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Old 24-05-2014, 22:18   #98
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Re: 85-Foot Motor Yacht Sinks at Launch

The launch video is slightly reminiscent of a smaller boat launch I once saw where the guy forgot to remove one of his stern tie downs off of the trailer before launching. That aside, the way the keel floated up looks very much like a case of insufficient ballast or unsecured ballast.
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Old 11-08-2014, 15:30   #99
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Re: 85-Foot Motor Yacht Sinks at Launch

Any up date on this.

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Cruisers Sailing Forum mobile app
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Old 11-08-2014, 15:43   #100
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Re: 85-Foot Motor Yacht Sinks at Launch

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Any up date on this.

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Well, New World is in receivership. Owner of Northern name and assets in litigation against New World. Amazing how fast the relationship between Northern and New World, Bud and Andy, deteriorated. Well, not that fast as it's been going down for a long time. Would not be a bit surprised to see the name rented out again to someone else to start up and fail again while harming many people. Oh and previous litigation is still open and in process.

Reality is a lot of debtors and no assets. New World doesn't own the property, much of the equipment, or the name. Nor to they own the boats being held on their property.

As to the investigation and determination of cause or causes, that will be some time before any information comes out.
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Old 22-08-2014, 07:46   #101
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Re: 85-Foot Motor Yacht Sinks at Launch

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Originally Posted by Nicholson58 View Post
I have a hard time looking at the proportions and imagining how the machinery can be low enough in this shallow draft vessel to make the center of mass be below the center of buoyancy. I wonder if the permanent ballast was even installed.

Dear Nicholson,

the only vessel with the center of mass below the center of buoyancy is the submarine - when submerged.

The metacentric height is what counts for stability:

Metacentric height - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Cheers,

Tomasz
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Old 22-08-2014, 11:56   #102
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Re: 85-Foot Motor Yacht Sinks at Launch

Wow! Did not know that. I always thought that a sailboat had the c.o.m. below the c.o.b.
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