Should this trouble discussion be closed?

[Alan Wheeler]

Even though I am not american nor do I view the thread in the same "total light" as the right to free speech blah blah(due to it's size a complexity and the fact that the "real" arguments are lost within it) I do agree with what you have said Gord and I too am leaning toward the "lets keep it" side of the argument.
Even though newbies start off on the wrong tangent, so far (I think) all the new ones have come to realise participants here are not as bad as they first thought (I would like to think that anyway) and so far all the new ones seem to have jioned in, in some positive way. Once again the perpetraters (in my view) that are using the thread to their own manipulitive devices, have never entered into any discussion here. In fact, I believe if they ever did, it would most likely continue to be the "name calling" type replies anyway. Even though they get some free miles from it now, in the end the result will be detrimental to their character.
As in a movie line from Scorpion King?, "they always get their come uppence".

GORD and Wheels. As always, cooler heads and all that. I agree with your reasoning. It is apparent from the low response, that the majority of members here do not have or wish to express an opinion on this. I would like to qualify one point regarding your comments GORD, I am not moving so censor anything, I think it could be beneficial to get rid of what has been said in the past to allow a fresh start.
On reviewing old threads, I have noticed that many of us, including myself, when first coming on the forum have either been taken wrong, or been discouraged at some point until people get to know us a bit. It seems that when people start on the Unfortunate turn thread, they often never get past that point.
It just seems to be one of those threads that brings out the worst in people, and I have not seen any recent posts there that actually contribute to the forum. I suppose having a place to go and rant when in a bad mood has it's advantages.
Just to be clear, I do not want to censor what has been said there.
All that being said, this poll has a self destruct for 14 days, and based on the limited response, I do not expect it to make a difference. It served it's purpose. It was designed to put the question out there once and for all. Keep it, or get rid of it. It has been asked and answered, and apathy seems to be the invisible winner.

[BC Mike]

My first post when I talked about my boat got zero replies.
A message to a thread that I joined in on got quite a few replies because the discussion topic was balsa core.
What I do not like about the thread being discussed is the accusations concerning the motive behind a post. How can anyone possibly know what motivates someone else. Accusations of jealousy and such are simply provoking, and border on slander. They go beyond free speech, so I do not mind if they get moderated away. I will always endevour to try and address the subject, not make personal insults. That has been lacking with some of the newbie target practice shots. Just my opinion as always.
Michael

[Wanderlust]

What started as an interesting an informative thread has degenerated into a waste of space, with so much bickering and posturing.

So I vote to close it down, and the sooner the better.

For those who responded to this thread, and posted, the question is answered. It seems there are many who would like to see the thread locked. It is also clear that there are a number of very good reasons to let it continue to live. Unfortunately, the number of votes, hardly qualifies as a quorum, I do not expect any drastic change with the bumfuzzle thread. I do, however think that the air is a little clearer. We have asked the question. It has been answered. It does not need to be asked again.

[Steve Rust]

I would vote to leave it. It seems to have degenerated into a pissing contest but if you don't like that well don't visit it or post to it. I read through it about a month ago and have not been back since or posted to it. Let it die from disinterest. If you kill it someone just start a new thread. Just think of it as the "crazy aunt in the attic".

[Alan Wheeler]

Besides. I am sure Pat will find some way of blaming it all on me if it got pulled. I took a look at his site the othernight. I hadn't been there for sometime. I think they had just left Oz or something the time I looked before last. So it beats me how I get the"stalker" tag But anyway's, I sat there like a stunned mullet for a few seconds as I read what he had said about me. Sheeesh, and this guy has the gaul to suggest I have a problem. Mate!
But anyway's, I think if we can all look past the fuzznut issues in this thread, there is still some good stuff in it. And it would be a pity to pull it and loose the good stuff. Pity it is such a big thread though, as trying to find the good stuff is a little difficult.

[RandyAbernethy]

While I have great respect for the essence of Gord's post I think that there are other aspects to consider. People assemble here to discuss Cruising. That's what this place is for. It is also a community where people interact on a social basis using cruising as a common spring board. Social interaction is great but is less interesting as archival data.

I suggest that one's freedoms end when they infringe upon another's. At the interface we must compromise and cooperate. Therefore: is it fair to bury good information and rigorous debate having archival value amidst social interaction that does not age well? This swarming behavior is a type of tyranny in and of itself which perverts the principle of free speech by amplifying a single perspective or set of opinions such that counterpoint can no longer be heard. I believe this is why courts have judges and forums have moderators.

Kai bears the burden of maintaining the charter.

[GordMay]

Randy:
You put that so much more clearly than J.S. Mill did, and I could have. Thanks.

Gord

As John Stuart Mill wrote (“On Liberty”): “...But the peculiar evil of silencing the expression of an opinion is, that it is robbing the human race; posterity as well as the existing generation; those who dissent from the opinion, still more than those who hold it. If the opinion is right, they are deprived of the opportunity of exchanging error for truth: if wrong, they lose, what is almost as great a benefit, the clearer perception and livelier impression of truth, produced by its collision with error ...”

[Ram]

I agree just about word for word with with Wheels & Gord on the subject, but would add I would not close the thread , why not ignore it and not respond to it, boycott it would be a better way, Im sure it will go away on its own if no one replys !
Ram

[markpj23]

I've stopped reading the thread because it's pretty much useless IMHO.

BUT - just because I disagree with its content does not mean it should be killed / stopped / removed.

I'm smart enough to decide for myself what to read.. in that great free-world tradition others often forget. I'm smart enough to know that "fair and balanced" coverage usually isn't if the authors have to tell you that it is, blah blah...

Let the thread live for those who choose to read it. To paraphrase Rodney Dangerfield "at least I can serve as a bad example."